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Author Topic: Kyranians distrust magic and magic users?  (Read 1828 times)
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Ash Tyr
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« on: December 13, 2012, 11:12:14 AM »

I've seen this mentioned here on the board, that Kyranians distrust magic. However, I cannot find anything to that effect in any of the Kyranian entries.

I play a Kyranian, so I'm curious. Am I just overlooking the info somewhere?
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Twn Arerwn
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« Reply #1 on: December 13, 2012, 01:27:36 PM »

As Garret and Deklitch are the developers for this tribe, I would assume that Dek's comments in the CD, where this is mentioned, are accurate. It may be a behind the scenes discussion for them. *shrug* Of this I am not sure, but only they could answer this question and it seems they have. Then again the post is over a year old, so things may be accurate on the site by this point.

It would be like trying to disagree with Remusian or Antislar aspects with Altario. Although possible it is extremely hard to do without some inside information. crazy
« Last Edit: December 13, 2012, 01:46:20 PM by Twn Arerwn » Logged

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Garret Arroway
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« Reply #2 on: December 13, 2012, 03:49:24 PM »

It is a little more that it is just too complicated for their lifestyle than fear,, but as Dek said, they don't really like or trust magic users much (not an outright hate like some northerns I know ;) ... ). As with most people, they don't trust what they don't understand, so no you wouldn't have many if any Kyranian magic users.

As mentioned, it was mostly in discussions between him and I on the development of the tribe. Tribal entries are so incredibly massive it is easy to overlook or leave out little details. And it is a little detail since as I said as it is a general dislike/distrust, not a deep hatred. Unfortunately, I still haven't had any desire at all to really write again yet, so there hasn't been any more progress on the tribe.

I noticed the Kyranian magic user pop back up on the site today and I stand by my previous statement, that there wouldn't be many, if any magic users.
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Ash Tyr
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« Reply #3 on: December 13, 2012, 08:06:56 PM »

The Kyranians' dislike of magic was mentioned in my CD as well. And the comment left me dumbfounded. I've read the Kyranian info; there's nothing on the site that mentions magic or suggests anything about the Kyranian opinion regarding it.

I don't have any Kyranian mages planned (I don't play mages, anyway), so for me, this is just something I wanted to know before I started to roleplay my character. It would be nice, though, if there was at least some small blurb about this distrust of magic in the People section of the entry. I say that mostly because anyone writing a Kyranian has no way to be aware of it until someone mentions it in their CD.

By the way, I would suggest running a spellcheck on the Kyranian entry. Spelling errors can be found in almost any entry, but there were quite a few in the tribe entry that honestly took away from the reading (like "dd" instead of "do"). Spelling is the greatest evil in the world and shouldn't be allowed to detract from good writing.

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Garret Arroway
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« Reply #4 on: December 13, 2012, 09:45:41 PM »

... As I said, I haven't really felt like writing for several years now, so I have not gotten around to making changes and additions to the tribe that have been worked out after the writing of it or were forgotten during it.

 Also, I don't run the site or upload information, so that is no completely on me. With such a big entry, it is easy for little things to be missed when it is uploaded onto the site. If you wanted to make a list of it and post it in the "Mistakes / Typos" post on the Dev side, I'm sure your they would greatly appreciate it.

If you don't like the tribe entry, then find another. Nothing on this site it perfect. And people burn out, things happen in life, and writing here is no longer of greater importance. I linger because this site meant a great deal to me a few years back and I like to check in from time to time because I put a lot of time and effort into my works on the development side and I still have a few friends on this side.

The distrust of magic is now heavily mentioned over here by the people that re-wrote the tribe, so anyone doing their research can find it.

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Ash Tyr
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« Reply #5 on: December 14, 2012, 05:24:56 AM »

The spelling errors are too numerous (and easily caught by any spellchecker) to warrant listing them anywhere. I mention them as a courtesy. I would want to know if anything I wrote had spelling errors.

I never said I didn't like the tribe. I don't write characters from tribes I don't like.

I did not say that you should write an addition to the tribe. As you've said, other writers have taken over the Kyranians. My point is more that comments should be based on info contained on the site, not info that exists only within the developers' minds.

There is the occasional exception. I remember clerics being approved when Talia did not have much of the clerical info up on the site. But her approval was also required for every cleric made.

I would also point out that discussions on the boards are often inaccurate and outdated. It's just the way of things. Comments made on the board are fixed in time (in the past) whereas the site continues to change and grow. The site contains the occasional inaccuracy as well, but those are hopefully caught and rectified.
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Deklitch Hardin
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« Reply #6 on: December 14, 2012, 06:15:41 AM »

Ash, I am assuming that you aren't involved in the development side of things here in Santharia, so you probably aren't aware of the process involved with making corrections to existing articles.

In summary, (and very basically) a developer writes an entry/composes music/'paints' a picture which is then opened up to other developers to comment on, before hopefully being declared right for inclusion on the site by a moderator. Following this, Artimidor, the site administrator uses HTML to put the entry up on the site. I don't know how knowledgeable you are with websites and HTML, but I can tell you it can take a long time to do so. While doing this, you aren't really on the look out for spelling errors, no matter how numerous or apparent they may be to someone else. After the entry has gone live, the way to suggest corrections to spelling mistakes/other mistakes that people think are warranted is by submitting a report on them on the http://www.santharia.com/dev/index.php?action=post;topic=5580.0 page so that Artimidor can get around to dealing with them if he feels that they need to be updated.

Sometimes, as Garret said, things are missed during the writing of the entry/thought of during/after the entry and updating entry piecemeal isn't a very productive use of our time. So we discuss them behind the scenes and decide on those things for the tribe. We also let people know those things about the tribe during the development of their CDs so that they are aware early on during proceedings, when the changes can 'hopefully' be made easily, rather than right at the end, where more major surgery is required. I know it isn't the perfect way of doing things, but it is how we do things here. :)

So, people can safely assume that Kyranians distrust magic.
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Vesk Lyricahl
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« Reply #7 on: December 14, 2012, 06:42:47 AM »

Ash = Vesk

If this is going to blossom into a discussion on how entries make it to the site, then I'll post on the name of mine that's associated with the dev board.

Yes, I'm aware of how the dev board works. I also know how difficult HTML is to work with. Arti has to link to another entry every single time any word referencing that entry is made. I wouldn't blame Arti at all for any spelling errors to make it onto the site, as those are up to the writer to catch beforehand. Mistakes happen and make it live, but proofreading should have eliminated many of the errors in the Kyranian entry (barring the possibility that English was not the writer's native language - but I know that many non-native speakers ask for a native speaker to proofread as well).

Anyway. The spelling is just nitpicking. The issue at hand is more about blindsiding writers with info that's not on the site. And it is easy to post an addition to any entry and get it approved. It's not necessary to rewrite the entire entry to do so. It doesn't even require that the entire entry be posted, just the part that's being rewritten. There's even a handy posticon for additions such as this.

Garret has stated that she's burnt out. I get that. I burned out ages ago in Bardavos as the mod there. But hey, you've stated that you love the Kyranians and want to continue her work. Seems like the fitting project for you. Kyranians distrust magic? Make it so.
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Kareesh Valendar
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« Reply #8 on: December 14, 2012, 07:34:37 AM »

Just putting my 2 sans in.....

But if it isn't on the site, just in the devver's mind or just posted somewhere randomly on the dev board, then how do we expect newbies to know this information? Yes, I understand how the dev board works, but someone new to Santharia isn't going to know that. Do we expect them to pour over both the site and the dev board to fully know the tribe?

If the Kyranians truly have a fear/distrust of magic, just stick a paragraph in on the site, just until the entry can be further re-written. I understand being burnt out on writing something, but how do we expect newbies to know what goes on in the minds of our developers? What if the Kyranians entry (just as an example) never gets re-written, or someone else re-writes them and doesn't say anything about the whole magic thing?

My main concern is just with the newbies who do take the time to research their tribe, read everything about them on the site, prepare a character in their head, and then when they post it, get told "No, no. You can't do that because of this" and then comes the confusion. That's my main point, I guess.
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Altario Shialt-eck-Gorrin
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« Reply #9 on: December 14, 2012, 12:09:53 PM »

 :D  My two sans...

We base the RP side on what is on site, not what is in a Devers mind.  And this coming from a Dever who always has as much in his mind as on site. Roll Eyes

As a Dever, we can add what we have in our head as suggestions, but not as a hard rule.  Explain how you see the dev moving forward.

As a CD creator, you are limited to what the site has.  However, if a Dev suggests how they see things going forward, it would be a courtesy to put that in, but not required.  We, as CD Mods, can make exceptions to certain things if they are not too extreme, and the Dev and the Player have a history of trust behind them.  (Meaning a newbie Dev is not going to create a new race that we will allow a brand new player to create a CD for)

A little compromise on both sides will go a long way.

There are a few Remusians on the boards, my own included, who do not follow the Remusian outline perfectly, because of the length of time it took to fully create the Remusian culture.  So, when I see a Remusian CD, I do offer suggestions, but I won't hold back a CD that goes against something not yet written.

There is also a CD in progress, whose player has spent much time picking my brain, adding things to his CD that is yet unwritten or unclarified on site, because he wants the CD to be as close to my vision of the true Remusian as possible.  As a Dever, I really appreciate that. It feels good.  But if he deviates from my unwritten vision, then that is his perogative.  If I don't want those deviations, then the onus is on me to change the entry.

Remember, fun is the goal, balanced with the rules of the site. :)
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Garret Arroway
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« Reply #10 on: December 14, 2012, 12:13:52 PM »

Apologies for being rude and snappy, but life is rough right now and was having a bad night. On top of that, it is incredibly frustrating that I'm burnt out because I still really want to work on my two tribes and bring them to life. Hence agitated when my ideas and vision for the tribe are questioned, but understand that it needs to be better documented.
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Deklitch Hardin
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« Reply #11 on: December 14, 2012, 01:32:25 PM »

Sorry for attempting to help here. It won't happen again
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