Santharian Development

Those of you with long memories will recall my Tattooing and Body modification entry, which I started way back when I first joined. This project is still very much alive, and I am currently gathering information for the next few sections to be added.

However, one area which I feel needs to be addressed is the relationship between tattooing, branding, scarification (scarring) and Magic.
I did tentatively mention this way back when, but I feel I need to dig a little deeper this time around, as I think there could be something good in this somewhere.

Here are a few points to ponder.

Could a magic user either create a tattoo by magical means, or wear a tattoo which has magical power. ie: as a focus?

Could these tattoos be capable of movement? Imagine an animated beast magically etched under the skin of the mage, moving from arm to chest to protect against fatal injury, or down to the hand where it's power can be unleashed!
Or an animated scene which draws the viewer into it, until they are lost forever?
Or a small flower tattoo on the ankle which grows before your eyes, until the wearers body is covered in delicate vines and leaves, flower heads gently swaying in the breeze, whilst malise gather their sweet nectar?

Could they change form, or colour? Perhaps as a warning device?

Could they be cast upon another as a form of curse?

Perhaps a particular spell requires that the words/symbols of the spell are permanently etched into the skin of the caster? Would this serve as the focus, as above?

Perhaps a magical tattoo could be given sentient powers? Have its own magical powers which could aid or otherwise the wearer?

I'm sure you can all see the kind of thing I'm looking for, all I need now are some of you magically inclined folk to ponder upon these questions and help me create something suitably fantastical for my entry!

Witch Queens of Marmarra place tatooed 'Seals' onto their high ranking agents. This forms a telepathic bond between them (along them to sub-vocally speak to each other conciously) and also allows the Witch Queen to inhabit the Sealed's senses.

For example, a spy will be sent into enemy territory. He will telepathically alert the Witch Queen who will then activate her ability to see through his eyes, allowing her to see all that is around him.

Helpful in the slightest?

Brilliant! An excellent example of the sort of thing I was looking for, Deci.

Is there a description of the tattoos and the method of application? If not, would you care to create one, or advise me of the vital requirements and I can write it. The choice is yours.

I haven't considered the method of application...but the design is that of an eye if that helps...

Any additional info is valuable, Deci. Would the eye resemble those seen in Egyptian hieroglyphs? The eye of Horus, I think it is?
Or is it of a cruder design?

Great ideas!

The Eye of Horus is actually what I modelled it on, but removing the fancy flick underneath....

I'll photoshop something up for you quickly....

PS: If Ximax can't do it, I hear the Krean - or what's left of them - are offering competitive prices. Might be worth checking. (For a discount, try our special promotion code: "Krean Magic in Plain Tharian")

What would be more fitting for the esoteric Krean Gypsies than various animated tatoos?

Here's the eye (attached)

Also note, this is the Eye I wanted put on the Marmarran Flag and Official Insignia Etc.

A perfect design for your requirements, if I may be so bold!

Now, all we need to do is come up with some kind of application method, and we can start to write the whole thing up for my entry.

I've taken the liberty of saving our chat so far onto a Word doc.

@ Coren.   Have you any suggestions for me, my friend? Please try to keep them clean and physically possible  ;)

Basically, I was trying to speak and Deci inter-meddled between my two posts... :rolleyes:

A "yes" to all the points you asked us to contemplate. If not possible under the Ximaxian system, then we will find a way under the Krean one.

And I am sure I have no idea what the latter half of you post is referring to. Your mind seems to perpetually wonder into inappropriate thoughts. Bad orc.

Well Eludian Sorcery (The Magic of the Witch Queens) is composed of:

- Ancient Krean Magic (mainly involving complex mind control)

- Gaishen Magic (Usage of corrupting spirits)

- Inami wisdom (An Ancient civilisation who had the ability to control the void to some extent)

Inami wisdom of some sort would make greater sense....

Hows this?!

Strange runes are tatooed onto the skin while chanting in 'The Tongue of the Inami'. This conveys a sort of 'void paradox' to the runes. The runes then rearrange themselves into the shape of the aforementioned eyes, but retain the so-called 'paradox'. It is this paradox, which links the Witch Queen mentally with the Sealed regardless of where they are physically.

Eh?

Deci

Well, it all sounds very impressive, Deci, I'll give you that! Do you have it in English?

That will come in useful for the entry, I have no doubt, but how are the tattoos actually put into the skin?

You mean the initial ink-runes?

I would suppose with constant hand-held needle poking?

Heard of Tebori?

Tebori. The original and best!

I wish I could afford to have one of the Japanese Masters tattoo me using the traditional methods....sigh

Anyway, is this the method you propose? Would you have me use wooden needles, or is there a specific animal whose bones could be splintered to use as needles? Or something with spikes? Or sharpened quills from some rare bird?

What about inks?

There's a lot more to this tattooing business than just jabbing someone with a sharp stick, y'know!  ;)

Not related to magic, but heavilly with Tattoos, we need to talk about the Faen at some point Tharoc. Maybe a good point on the MirThmoot agenda?

Absolutely! I suppose we should at least try to give the appearance of having accomplished something during our weekend!

Just to give me a fighting chance, what precisely were you proposing?

@Marmarran Magic Tattoos

Octopus Ink!

I don't know Tharoc, whatever you think is best. My only requirements are the design and the effects, you can define everything else in whatever way you see fit!

@Faen

The Faen are completely tatooed all-over! Its done by the Order of Poetpriests, who do alot of things actually....

The Faen have symbolic tattoos all over their body, depicting things such asclan, archivements, important happenings, family ties etc etc etc. Basically, a faen can look at a faen and know all the important bits about him/her. Provided there are no clothes involved of course :P

Ricco quills (which are very sharp,  hollow and often used for medicinal purposes) might work for tattooing purposes as well.  They're fairly common little animals and can be found all over.

Alysse

@ Mira. So you want to discuss just what form these tat's take? And methods of application etc?
No probs.....but as for the no clothes thing......can I keep my socks on?  :grin:

@ Deci. Brilliant! I'd forgotten your octopus! That would be ideal. How soon do you need me to write the methods/tools?

Thanks, Alysse. I'll bear that in mind.

I was going to see if there were any animals/plants sacred to the Marmarrans which they may choose to use in the ceremony. If indeed there is a ceremony attached to it........DEEECCCIIIII!

No Rush!

And if you are talking about my Mollusk...You would be talking about the Ink Dumpling or Filachara! This ink could have found its way to Marmarra, depending on how big the Faen trade web was by 1649 b.s.

You could always reference the much rarer Charalara Octopus. While its less common in the Western Bay than the Filachara, there are no Filachara on the Southern Coasts whatsoever!

If you want something comprehensive:

'The Marmarran tatooists who apply the runes in this sealing process generally use the processed ink of the Charalara Octopus, a plentiful resource due to the Queendom's vassal settlements along the so-called 'Morose Shores' '

Hows that for you?

Deci

Well Tharoc, as for the socks thing.. me and Ms. W will have to discuss that when we get to it.

The 'ceremony' is likely to be conducted out of public sight, as the Witch Queens would want as few people as possible hear the Inami encantations and see the Inami runes...most of what we would know about the process would come from people who are part of the process and leaked information out (bribery anyone?).

Deci

@ Deci. This is good stuff! I can write a pretty comprehensive section to my entry with this information. Thank you, kind sir! I shall, of course, be giving you exclusive editorial rights to the Marmarran section, when it is finished.  ;)

@ Mira. I'm just off to the shops, to see if I can buy a pair of neck-high socks!

This is finally what I have been looking for.  You may notice the runes etched into my skin.  Before I came to Santharia I had them etched into my skin.  In my newbie forum I explained they held great power for me in my old world.  Well for some reason they are no good here in Santharia.  I am powerless and in fact they have begun to itch and burn.  I would appreciate if you could research ways to remove magical runes (without killing the host).  One lesser minded individual suggested I wash them off.  Very funny.  I will pay dearly to have these runes removed.  I will pay even more dearly to have new, more powerful runes applied.  Perhaps you need something illustrated. ;)

Keep in mind, each rune provides the host a unique power.  Combinations of certain runes unlocks deeper magic.  However the host must be very careful.... for if they are not aware of the affects of one rune on another they can become possessed, diseased, weakend or just simply die.  I have even heard of runes being used on enemies or slaves to place them bondage or servitute.  Never let someone tattoo you unless you know how it will effect you. 

Ok wait...so magic tattoos are going to be an exclusive Nybelmarian thing? No fair!

However...I don't see magic tattoos as fitting well within the Ximaxian system. The power of a tattoo is a sort of focus for magic and Ximaxian magic doesn't require a focus, only willpower to accomplish what is needed. Telekinesis, evocation magic, necromancy, etc can all be done using the Ximaxian system. The tattoo would have to be some kind of focal point of ounia that can be manipulated, but a mage can manipulate ounia anywhere at anytime without the need for a focus.

Nevertheless, mystical tattoos should be a foreign concept and Nybelmar is a perfect place for that. It would be a new magic system, of course, and quite different than the Ximaxian system.

Somehow...I see tattoo magic as being more divine than arcane. As if the gods themselves granted a portion of their power on someone using a tattoo. Having the mark of the divine, whether from a god or a demon, would grant a person abilities far beyond those of a mere commoner. Imagine a follower of Ghelgath who has a mark of the demon imprinted on his skin by a powerful cleric. With it, he can use dark spells to attack or defend himself. Or perhaps a tattoo is made as a curse upon someone that hinders them somehow.

Yes...having divine magic within a tattoo would be grand, and if developed in Nybelmar, away from Ximaxian "theory", you wouldn't need to have Avarian clerical magic to base it off of...

*pokes Talia* We going to get that done someday, maybe?  :P

It doesnt realy have to be a new magic system per se Azzy. Possibly a new application of an older one though.

The Faen tatoos, although set be the Poetpriests, are perfectly mundane. The Marmaran Seal mark is empowered by Eludian sorcery, which is arcane magic if i am not mistaken. The Trumarim... well, i would have to discuss with Bard Judith if i can in fact give them the magic i want to give them, but it would be closely related to your idea of specific tattoos granting special powers.

Eludian Sorcery is somewhere in between Spiritual and Arcane:

'Manipulation of Spiritual concepts in an academic fashion' would be a good sypnosis...

And um...Trumarim Magic?

Hm? What? I said no such thing. Everyone know there is no Trumarim Magic.



It's going to be Nybelmarian Dwarven Magic, if i get my way.


And i did not say that either. You're hearing things again. Now go be usefull somewhere :P

@ Azzy. I have no problem with any tribe/race/individual using this suggestion. However, I doun't think we should have every Thom, Dyck and Haree wandering about covered in death-dealing ink. That would never do.  :evil:

No sooner had I posted the opening salvo in this thread when Deci, Mira and Coren (not neccessarily in that order) leapt on it hungrily. As the Nybelmarian Triumverate have shown such an interest in it, perhaps we should let them show us what can be acheived with a little hocus-pocus and a bottle of Stanleys blue-black?

Coren especially has already laid claim to vast swathes of my ideas, promising to shoehorn them into the Krean magical system, one way or another. That should be........interesting!

@ Seeker. Feel free to illustrate any of my ideas, in this thread or from the Compendium. As resident tattooist, I reserve the right to do my own doodles for the main Body Modification entry. Which I will........eventually......honest........Arti, Judy...why you looking at me like that?

Hm, I'll have to see if I can outdo you with Susilgerim magic, hehe. My dwarves will make plenty use of tattoos, methinks. If the Bard ever gets started on the rewrite for the Susilgerim *hint*. Oh wait, I didn't say any of that either...

Greetings, Morden. And welcome to the Santharian Tattoo Moot o9!

I remember back in the day, when I asked Judy what kind of tattoos the Dwarves may utilise. I was told (quite rightly, I thought), that they were too hairy to have them. Not enough bare skin, see?

However, my suggestion that they may have their noses inked never did receive a reply.........

Couldnt they dye the hairs into special patterns?

Thats not really a tattoo though is it Nsiki?

Well, not technically - but make do with what you've got, huh?