Santharian Development

Santharian World Development => The Santharian Library => Topic started by: Bard Judith on 07 October 2001, 08:22:00



Title: Collected Sayings and Proverbs
Post by: Bard Judith on 07 October 2001, 08:22:00
Disguised as a humble strolling minstrel, Bard Judith has gone out among the people of Santharia and listened to their tales, stories, and sayings.  In the process she has collected a great number of folktales that will someday come to light.... but for now she offers a small collection of everyday expressions of Santharia, selected from a variety of races.

Enjoy!
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PROVERBS AND SAYINGS OF SANTHARIA

Every fruit has a stone, as the plainsfolk say. (Barbarian proverb about mixed blessings)

As well heel wolves.... (used with a comparative phrase to suggest futility, for example, ‘As well heel wolves as argue with that woman in one of her moods!’)

You can always add more salt to the stew, but only the Gods can take it out. (Midland peasants’ expression, meaning, ‘don’t hurry to make changes’)

Dwarves to their caverns and elves to their trees.  (Popular among the city nobles, meaning, ‘to each their own’)

One man’s Brownie is another man’s stew.  (Unfortunate legacy of a time in human history.  Said to have been coined by Zlothig the Brutal, one-time plains warlord.  Now used ironically to warn others of racist or exclusionary language!)

Tide change, heart change!  (translated from Mermish.  Used when speaking about decisions and promises , which merfolk take lightly.)

Water is soft, but it wears away stone.  (Sailors’ saying, on the virtue of persistence)

As the seed is formed in Ava’s Dream, so the tree grows in Ava’s Light.  (Elven, on the inevitability of human nature)

Man good when dead.  (Orcish.  How this proverb was obtained and translated we are not certain.  Possibly originally  a Human fabrication, but it since has passed into common lore.)

When the wind is in the east, Grotor blows for man and beast,
When the wind is in the west, Iasha will sing the best.
When the wind is from the south, Neter opens then his mouth,
When the wind is from the north,  let no farmer issue forth.

(An Ashmarian farmer’s chant, naming the spirits of the winds.  Note the variation on gods’ names, associated with three of the winds. Although ordinary air movements on the surface of Santharia are called ‘wind’, most people do not confuse them with the High Winds or the Darkwinds!  Here obviously some local folk beliefs have corrupted orthodox doctrine.)

Spring sap rises, autumn leaves fall.  (Elven, meaning ‘life always moves from one stage to another.’

Gold in the ground is rock still.  (Dwarvish equivalent of ‘a bird in the hand’.)          

A wrinkled apple tastes the sweeter.  (Peasant saying, on the benefits of experience)



Title: Re: Collected Sayings and Proverbs
Post by: Winlok on 07 October 2001, 14:08:00
Quote:
Human expression:
                             fruits of labor are received by tillers of the soil




Title: Re: Collected Sayings and Proverbs
Post by: Artimidor Federkiel on 09 October 2001, 13:35:00
And Bard Judith strikes again! How lucky we are to have you here:)  Thanx for another treasure to dig in!



Title: Re: Collected Sayings and Proverbs
Post by: Gean Firefeet on 10 October 2001, 01:27:00
I guess it would be good for everyone else to make additions? Idea looks excellent... no idea if I have enough inspiration left to make up any, but I'll give it a try.



Title: Re: Collected Sayings and Proverbs
Post by: SmurfStormcrow on 11 October 2001, 18:50:00
Sounds good. I'll try to come up with a few sayings of my own for Corloth.

Stormcrow

Psychotic Wizard-Type



Title: Re: Collected Sayings and Proverbs
Post by: Bard Judith on 17 October 2001, 07:47:00
Drogo actually wrote some Barbarian-flavoured sayings as a jest, back in the Introductions section, if I remember aright...

Perhaps we could select or adapt some of them and add them into our collection?

Stuff like:

Queypur hath no fury like a scorned Barbarian woman

and so on.

Could be usable (grin) if we ever get Drogo back...



Title: Re: Collected Sayings and Proverbs
Post by: Artimidor Federkiel on 17 October 2001, 13:14:00
Yeah, finding proverbs (or curses also, e.g. "By the Steps of Colthoi!" reminding of the infinite, blood-soaked stairs at the Temple of Ma'asherom) sounds like an interesting and funny sport! Will put up the first results we have already on the site next update (hope the menu changes don't require all of my time, though).



Title: Some More Dwarven Expressions
Post by: Bard Judith on 21 October 2001, 07:16:00
"Falls and fells!”  (expletive)

“Between the pickaxe and the rockface...” (difficult situation)

“Not for all the gold in Gerimthur!” (a famous mine)

“He who hews not eats not.” (on the virtue of work)

“Discussion gathers no gems.”  (ditto)

“An elf’s tongue will talk the Timelight round.”

“The shedwarf at the hearth and the hedwarf at the face; thus swings the world in balance.”  

(work is gender-specific in Thergerim culture, but not assigned arbitrary values as it might be in many human cultures.  Both mining and food preparation are seen as essential to support life, and dwarf society does not discriminate between the sexes. Tol-Baroll is, you will remember, God of Forges and Earthworks but also God of Hearths and Cooking...  Rulers, religious leaders, teachers, and so on are drawn equally from both genders.  )

"Pitdamp!" ( expletive, drawn from a mining term.  Dangerous gasses often build up underground, and can explode in the present of open flame...)





Title: Re: Some More Dwarven Expressions
Post by: Capher on 21 October 2001, 08:44:00
Very good ;) ;)  

With deepest regards,Capher



Title: Re: Some More Dwarven Expressions
Post by: Artimidor Federkiel on 21 October 2001, 09:21:00
I've used some proverbs/saying/curses already in my Avaesthoría chapters. Should dig them out and update the entry with them, I guess.



Title: Re: Collected Sayings and Proverbs
Post by: Thuja on 25 October 2001, 16:29:00
If you go to the Dune Mouse there are two sayings that can be added to our list.  They are in the Myth section of its description.  Just thought I would let you know.

If you think the sky's the limit, then you have no imagination.



Title: Re: Collected Sayings and Proverbs
Post by: Bard Judith on 25 October 2001, 20:29:00
Well, I guess a bard is indeed the most logical person to go running round our virtual Santharia collecting these sayings, so....

I volunteer to search the site and pull what we've currently got (from Drogo, Art, Thuja...anyone else?) together.  I'll edit some of Drogo's coz he wrote them extremely tongue-in-cheek (grin) and start a collation of proverbs.

Should we include a separate "Proverbs and Sayings of the ____(race name) for each race in the Compendium, or put them under their own separate Compendium Title and then sort by race within that?

Regards from the Bard

Bard Judith

"If you will listen to this lay but a little while now,
I will tell it at once as in town I have heard it told,
as it is fixed and fettered
in story brave and bold,
thus linked and truly lettered,
as was loved in this land of old."

J.R.R.Tolkien, 'Sir Gawain and the Green Knight'



Title: Re: Collected Sayings and Proverbs
Post by: Theodorus Holzman on 26 October 2001, 02:41:00
"As trusthworthy as a human" (Mullog:very unreliable)

"As nice as an Imp" (Very mean)

"You might as well harvest Krakenweed with bare hands" (Mullog: What you're doing is incredibly stupid)

"To talk like an Elf" (Troll: Talking very fast and difficult)

Okay, no more inspiration. See what you can do with these. (I like the Troll's saying)

Theodorus



Title: Re: Collected Sayings and Proverbs
Post by: Artimidor Federkiel on 26 October 2001, 12:54:00
This work would be appreciated, Judith:)  Well, I propose to at least mention the origin of the proverb/saying (if applicable), but I tend to put it all in one table and one entry. You then could look it up alphabetically and see - ah! that's a dwarven proverb, e.g.



Title: Old sayings
Post by: Ralhag Silverskin on 02 November 2001, 12:02:00
Can I say just one?


"It'll not be my head on the block."  (Human, it means, I won't be the one that gets in trouble.")

Thx

At yer service,

Ralhag



Title: Re: Old sayings
Post by: Koldar Mondrakken on 03 November 2001, 07:14:00
"It's like chopping wood with an Orcish knife."

Doing something completely senseless and without thought.
Orcs would say: "It's like chopping dwarves." ;)

Koldar Mondrakken, Knight of the Moonlight



Title: Re: Old sayings
Post by: Capher on 03 November 2001, 09:43:00
"By Sophronia's Hand" (What ever the cost.)

With deepest regards,Capher



Title: Re: Old sayings
Post by: Dala Valannia on 16 November 2001, 23:22:00
We need more gruff soldier type curses. 'Armeros's Teeth!!' is one of my personal favourites but it wears thin if every grizzly veteran uses it. Plus I have no idea what's so cursy about Armeros's teeth, unless they're filed like sharks, otherwise it just sounds good :rolleyes  

'Damn It!' just doesn't seem to work as well in Santharia....



Title: Re: Old sayings
Post by: Koldar Mondrakken on 17 November 2001, 04:14:00
Ok, let's go:

"By Queprur's hand!"

"For the crown!"

"Will Queprur lend me her sickle!"

"May Seyella guide, Armeros help us and Nehtor cure us afterwards."

"Biting Ogres!" = "SH**!"

"By Armeros' beard!" = "I don't believe this!"

"Eyasha, forgive me!"

"An Caltharian sword!" "Somewhat very strong and dangerous!"

"Orcish babble." "stupid"

"The Lances of the Twelve!" = "Anything stands against it."

"The Morashty can have thee!" Curse

"May Foiros burn you!"

"... like the thickness of a dwarven beard." = "very strong"

"... as thick as a dwarven skull." = "very stubborn"

"May Etherus abandon you!" = "hmmm... err... you know!"


has to be sorted out but I think some are cool!

Koldar Mondrakken, Knight of the Moonlight



Title: Re: Old sayings
Post by: Capher on 17 November 2001, 09:48:00
Here is one of mine I am using in my story "May Armerous hand guide her/him." =prayer to the God of War to avenge.

With deepest regards,Capher



Title: Re: Old sayings
Post by: John Silvercryst on 17 November 2001, 14:48:00
Do we have some harsh sounding one sylable words out there that can fit into this?  Because that is what we mostly use over here for our "swear" words.  I'm thinking that we can use "D*mn it", because we probably used that throughout the years.  Just putting in my wooden nickel :)  in.

"But we've got the biggest, balls of them all!"  AC/DC,  Big Balls



Title: Re: Old sayings
Post by: Greybark on 17 November 2001, 20:21:00
Oh, go kiss a dragon = go play on the freeway

the problem is, swearing just doesn't make sense! All the words we use for it are talking about sex, bodily functions, or eternal punishment. In Chinese the swear words talk about sex and death. In ancient times, didn't they get more descriptive, and take their time to insult someone thouroughly?



Title: Re: Old sayings
Post by: Uragel on 17 November 2001, 21:14:00
Make like a sheppard = get the flock out of here

;)

yes / no  ??

Uragel!
Do not seek to follow in the footsteps of the men of old; seek what they sought.



Title: Re: Old sayings
Post by: Dawn Mist of Myth on 17 November 2001, 21:40:00
These are all good quotes and curses :evil  and I have an idea for how to compile them together.  How about dividing them into sub groups such as : curses, war, love, power, aspiration, wealth,,, ect. ect.  They wouldn't have to be these exactly but something that would describe what the quote was about and then by the quote put what race, or class the quote came from.  Just a thought.

"See the Tree in the seed, The rainbow in the storm, and the frost in the sunset."



Title: Re: Old sayings
Post by: Dala Valannia on 17 November 2001, 22:56:00
I guess there's always the usual 'Blast it!!!'? Neutral sounding enough to be stuck in a fantasy world's colloquialisms?

I remember one Chinese curse where the user basically curses the cursed's descendents, the males would therefore be eternal slaves and the females would be prostitutes. Another cruder one has the cursee cursing the cursed's future male progenies's to be born without a rectum....potent stuff, Chinese curses ;)



Title: Re: Old sayings
Post by: Greybark on 17 November 2001, 23:41:00
Remind me never to get you mad, Dala ;)



Title: Re: Old sayings
Post by: Betsy the cow on 18 November 2001, 14:51:00
I don't know about the ancient times swearing, but lets ask someone who was there.  (Any ideas?)

Question: Do we have a hell?

MOOOOOOO!!!!

Edited by: Betsy the cow at: 11/17/01 8:58:42 pm


Title: Re: Old sayings
Post by: Xarl on 18 November 2001, 16:34:00
Betsy, I'm afraid the three Psyrpents I'm keeping for research are getting hungry. So, if you'll just follow me...
*various unpleasant sounds*
But to answer your question, yes we do. I count 2, one within the Void and the Nether(Planes? World?) counts as one too.



Title: Re: Old sayings
Post by: Gean Firefeet on 20 November 2001, 14:14:00
Well I don't really know about swearing, I think they didn't do so much swearing/flaming and all that. However, I do think they had some of them. For instance, I remember 'Mehercle' form my Latin lessons, meaning something like 'by Hercules'. So swearing was probably related to gods and other persona of higher worlds, giving them the fault of your ill fate.



Title: Re: Old sayings
Post by: Artimidor Federkiel on 20 November 2001, 14:16:00
Dividing the quotes into certain categories sounds like a good idea - especially in the long run when there are more quotes accumulated. But I don't know which categories would fit best...



Title: Swearing....
Post by: John Silvercryst on 20 November 2001, 15:45:00
WHat did the people in ancient times say when they hit their thumb with a hammer?  I don't think they would just be quiet about it and saying somthing long at your own thumb doesn't sound like somthing that would be done. I'm probably wrong, but needed to ask.



Title: Re: Swearing....
Post by: Dawn Mist of Myth on 21 November 2001, 02:07:00
As for dividing them into categories I think that first you would have to compile your list .... list of quotes and such... then go from there.  What does it describe, what is the quote about.  I think it would be interesting work.  Take what you have here and open a line for others to send there made up quotes in to be added to the hopper.  Then you would just have to read through them... kinda time consuming but fun never the less.  :)  Once again just an idea, rambled though it might be.  Just call me the rambling poster!:b  

"See the Tree in the seed, The rainbow in the storm, and the frost in the sunset."



Title: Re: Swearing.... Don't read if easily offended!
Post by: Bard Judith on 21 November 2001, 09:00:00
Historically CURSES have been long and elaborate, in order to impress the person you are swearing at.
PROVERBS have been short, balanced, and pithy - usually containing an educational aspect, easily remembered and passed on thru history.
EXPLETIVES have been divided into several parts - either PROFANITY , VULGARITY, or BLASPHEMY - to be technical about it....  Blasphemy is obviously taking God's name (or here in Santharia, gods' names) lightly; eg. "By TolBarol's hammer!"
Vulgarity refers to bodily functions such as excretion or sex, generally speaking.  "Firefarts!" or "Feffin' right!"   Characterised by 'plosives' and 'fricatives' (which are NOT more cusswords, but fancy words for harsh, sharp sounds such as F, P and T), Profanity is a combination of the above, plus any expressions that 'profane' or 'defile' a normal action or thing.  "Bloody", or "Hell", used as a swearword would be such an example.  They are always short, sharp, and vivid.

Everybody clear on that?  OK, keep sending in your examples then!  Hope no elves were offended ... (I suspect elves do NOT swear, even if they hit their thumbs with hammers.  Maybe they get around that by not using hammers???)  :)

Regards from the Bard



Title: Re: Swearing.... Don't read if easily offended!
Post by: Artimidor Federkiel on 21 November 2001, 15:15:00
*haha* "Firefarts..." *grin*

Hmmm... But, well I guess these three groups indeed would serve the purpose. What would we do without Bard Judith? - I'll put dividing the section at my to-do-list...



Title: Re: Swearing.... Don't read if easily offended!
Post by: Koldar Mondrakken on 21 November 2001, 18:25:00
What would we do without Judith? ....Hmmmm... :/

Not feeling like waking up in English class, perhaps? Or elementary school? Or... ;)

:lol  

Koldar Mondrakken, Knight of the Moonlight



Title: ..."Easily offended!"
Post by: Bard Judith on 22 November 2001, 08:51:00
Ok, Knight.  (bard roll up sleeves)

Next time me use all short words.

 Lots of space.   Talk like orc.

Make good for all man to read.

Too many hits on knight's head?  Poor knight. Me sorry.

Me not fix his work!  He not laugh my work!

Next time me make more hits on head.

(bard wave fist at him)


Mad Bard Jude

(bard stick out tongue and run off)





Title: Re: ..."Easily offended!"
Post by: Capher on 22 November 2001, 12:27:00
:lol   :lol   :lol  


*ducks as lute is swung at him.*

With deepest regards,Capher

Edited by: Capher at: 11/21/01 10:07:54 pm


Title: Re: ..."Easily offended!"
Post by: Gean Firefeet on 22 November 2001, 15:42:00
Ack, make sure you don't destroy your lute in the headpunching process, it would be a shame for all this poetry not musically enhanced anymore...

"Me likes this scene!"

*makes sure he leaves the thread before he instead is chased by the illhumoured bard*



Title: Re: ..."Easily offended!"
Post by: Theodorus Holzman on 23 November 2001, 09:51:00
Does this mean we've got an Orish Bard now? And does that mean we get Orcish poems?

"Destiny, chance, fate, fortune-they're all just ways of claiming your successes without claiming your failures."



Title: Re: ..."Easily offended!"
Post by: Koldar Mondrakken on 23 November 2001, 13:21:00
*Ouch* *Ouch* *Ouch* *ducking hiding under a table*

I think I understood the lesson, oh Great Mastersinger! I'll never offend you again, great singer, fabulous bard. Your poems will enlighten the world with their glory even when the last star falls! May Avá guide you on your way to glory!

Koldar Mondrakken, Knight of the Moonlight



Title: Narrowed Eyes...
Post by: Bard Judith on 25 November 2001, 00:36:00

(with hauteur, and just a trace of a pout if one looks closely)

I do thank thee for thy gracious and unsolicited praise.

Perchance I shall reconsider the Satire I was about to write upon the merits of chivalry and instead create a war chant for the noble Koldar, brave knight who also knows how to soothe a wrathful woman...

(Historical Note:  This is why bards have been feared and respected throughout history - just in case!)

(starts retuning her lute and humming chord progressions contentedly to herself...)



Title: Re: Narrowed Eyes...
Post by: Theodorus Holzman on 28 November 2001, 14:30:00
I found this one somewhere, although I don't remember where. I found it worth mentioning:
"A "friend" behind you is more dangerous than an enemy in front of you" or something similiar. I guess it means something like: "better have your enemy where you can watch his moves, than some unreliable friends where you can't see them."

"Destiny, chance, fate, fortune-they're all just ways of claiming your successes without claiming your failures."



Title: Re: Narrowed Eyes...
Post by: Mandolin Redd on 28 November 2001, 16:18:00
Hmm..
I seem to have taken to saying: “Queprur's Sickle!”



Title: Re: Narrowed Eyes...
Post by: Theodorus Holzman on 10 December 2001, 05:32:00
Sayings from the general:
"Quantity is Quality": A superior armed group can still be destroyed by hordes of lesser or not armed men.

"He who flees lives to fight another day": you shouldn't let any of your enemies escape the battlefield.

"For a dead soldier, there's no victory": You shouldn't try to achieve victory by sacrificing valuable men.

"Destiny, chance, fate, fortune-they're all just ways of claiming your successes without claiming your failures."



Title: Brownie Sayings
Post by: Greybark on 22 December 2001, 02:35:00
Always look before you leap off the branch -- be careful
Check to see who's dinner first -- a reminder not to bite off more than you can chew, or attack something that will probably end up eating you



Title: More Expletives....
Post by: Bard Judith on 22 December 2001, 04:53:00

"Feffin'!" (used as an adjective inserted within a sentence for emphasis, thus:  "Who woke the feffin' dragon up, eh?"  Meaning is debated, but most linguistic scholars in Sorren agree that it originated with human sailors and spread rapidly around the known world...)

"Co'or-ridden" (also an emphatic adjective, meaning 'haunted', or 'dammed'.  Eg:  "That Co'or-ridden baron wants ta double our taxes - does'e think we're made o' feffin' gold?"

"Herkpt'in' " (emphatic verb, colloquial.  "Herkpting" is the action of snorting up phegm and spitting it out.  The verb is properly pronounced in three syllables with the stress on the first and third, thus: HERK-pih-Ting.   "The old man was busy herkpting into the spittoon, and didn't see the soldiers striding towards him."  However, it has been co-opted as a vulgarism, and as such is pronounced HERK-pit-ten.  "You herkptin' piece of gnoll snot, whateryer think yer doing?"

"Kack!"  Broadly translated, means, 'excrement'.  Pronounced with two hard 'k' sounds.  Commonly used when one hits one's thumb with one's battlehammer, or when trying to repair household water pipes.  Can also be conjugated very effectively, as in "Kacking hammer hit me on the kacky thumb!" or "This kacked-up pipe's got no kackin' water in it!" or even "You kack-faced Drell cubs got no backbone ta be soldiers in THIS army!"


;] (bard rather enjoying herself swearing) ;}  Don't tell Arti I said that!



Title: Re: More Expletives....
Post by: John Silvercryst on 22 December 2001, 09:23:00
that was the most impressive piece of unpronunceable nonsense swearing that I have yet to witness.

You must go down before you go out.



Title: Re: More Expletives....
Post by: Koldar Mondrakken on 22 December 2001, 18:26:00
Cool examples, Judith! :)  

Koldar Mondrakken, Knight of the Moonlight



Title: Re: More Expletives....
Post by: Xarl on 23 December 2001, 23:20:00
Ksumarii Sayings

"Even Orcs have a use"- Nothing is a complete loss.
"Sunspawn!"- Something along the lines of "Son of a -GUN-!"
"Moonlight becomes you, (blank)"- Not-too-subtle death threat, as Kasumarii funeral rites involve placing the body in full view of the moon.
"The night is your guard, but your shadow my life"- Kasumarii equivalent of a proposal. Rumored to be the first line in a poem by Kasumar to Tyrajall.
Few more as I think of 'em...

Xarl Bluestride, Archmage of the White Arcana, Master of the Magic Forum, and generally cool guy. All requests are to be written on the back of a ten-dollar bill (or equivelant thereof) placed on a dead ferret, and tossed in the sewer system.
Xarl Bluestride
Owner of the longest sig in Santharia



Title: Re: More Expletives....
Post by: Bard Judith on 27 December 2001, 08:28:00
(snickering) Great death threat....how creative!

And that has to be one of the more romantic and yet understated proposals on record.

Love these, guys....keep 'em coming!

(bard wanders off giggling to herself..."moonlight, hah!")