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[Artimidor Federkiel]

As I've already stated I need to confer this all with Nate of Sorren (Game Development), because magic spells will affect the game considerably. So I definitely need to hear his opinion on these topics before we can decide on how we'll handle magics in order to prepare them for the game.

However, I see no big problem why we shouldn't start with setting up spells and we have some nice outlines here already as I can see. However, most important are the things I've mentioned above. Instead of quantity we should go for quality of description. Once again: Read my first posting! In this respect we also should mainly work on a general description: What is a cleric spell, what is a mage's spell (perhaps we need even cosmological reasons here)? Where will we use reagents? Who will need spellbooks? Will clerics learn spells automatically if they achieve higher levels? What are the different kinds of magics concerning different races? We need a general concept in this respect first. Such general descriptions would have to look like if they were only made for the site, completely independent from the game. Then we should add a section on how this could/should/will be realized for the game.

These things are the first we should do. It doesn't help much if we don't have the general outline for all spells before we work on detailed spells. If we work on spells BTW we should work one after the other - one detailed description after the other. When I say >300 spells I mean that not all spells will be available for humans e.g., only a certaun amount will be. This could be interesting in the game - that certain races, who have learned certain spells at certain schools can do completely different spells. A party of mages can do much more then one mage alone. Also more then 8 levels are quite ok, I'd say, because the longer it takes to reach the top, the better.

Proposals so far sound fine, e.g. the cleric spells based on the Gods from Theo, I would only give them other names, e.g. "Grothat's Blessing" could be re-named to something like "Grothar's Hand" etc. Something in this direction.

But please remember: We need general descriptions on magic and how and who can cast what as well as a scheme first for the description of all spells before we can go into greater detail! This should have topmost priority now.

[Greybark]

what Vortex? I don't remember anyone creating one....
If you mean the Etherial Void, that has nothing to do with an underworld....check the compendium entry.

[Capher]

Greybark there is a deepwinds portal in northern sarvonia maybe thats what they are talking about?  Otherwise I have no idea and I agree with Art, Nate should be in on this discussion.

With deepest regards,Capher

[Theodorus Holzman]

Okay, I'll rewrite those Spells. The Spell structure will be changed too, destructive gods (Fire, Death) get more destructive spells and healing and constructive gods (Forging, Healing, Peace & Unity) get more protective and healing Spells. The number of spells per god will remain six though. The only one I wanted to keep was "god's precense", maybe under another name, but I had thought of a bit Myth/Lore for those. Something like: "When all the gods are present and will start fighting eachother, the outcome will decide the destiny of the World as we know it." But this was just a thought.
Another Myth/Lore Spell: "Ask Avá Spell"

Avá's recognition: Spell that can only be cast by the Chosen one. Grants caster immortallity, eternal youth and power as great as Coór. Avá has chosen this one to banish Coór from this world, in a last attempt to save her dream from evil. But nobody knows anything about who could be the Chosen. If caster isn't the Chosen, he'll be destroyed. (possible elvish word meaning chosen: "Anahka" from the book/serie "The Elenium" of David Eddings).
But this was also just a thought too, I won't be surprised if you say it's a bit too extreme to implement.

Theodorus

[Artimidor Federkiel]

Avá's recognition is indeed too extreme, Theo! If you could cast it nobody would have the slightest chance against you..

[Theodorus Holzman]

Yeah, but that's the fun. Only one person can cast it and because he/she is chosen by Avá he should be pure of heart and ask Avá to take away his powers if he has defeated Coór.  But I can understand your problem. It's indeed to extreme. But it occured to me. And as a Dutch expression says: Never shot is always a miss. (freely translated.)

Theodorus

[Xarl]

Oh, one small idea. Clerics can also Bless or Curse objects, giving them a small amount of Magical Power. An Etherus-cursed object may be wanted by all, an Eyasha-blessed sword will merely knock opponents unconcious, a stick blessed by Jeyriall may blossom with fruit, and armor cursed by Armeros will admit any blow. You get the idea. And only one spell goes to the few Elven Clerics of Ava. Try this: Ava's Tears. Causes one of the High Goddess' tears to fall on the spot. Has immense magical potential, and can be shaped by the caster's will. Yer call.

[Koldar Mondrakken]

Don't know but there should be a good research on what kind of magic is dedicated to which magical school. See also my Weaver-comment.
I think that magic is well-balanced and explained either for RPG and to fit well into the world (and not everyone is wondering why you don't just get a mage and solve the problem!)  

Koldar Mondrakken, Knight of the Moonlight

[nate]

I wrote some spells for sorren.  It was put into a database a few years ago.  It took me a few months to type them out.  They were classified into different spell books.  There was life, death, nature, and a couple other categories.  I don't remember exactly how many there were, but I still have the database somewhere.

Before we take on the task of refining spells we need to have a clear set of stats.  So then the spells will be able to effect something.  Like a healing spell effects someone's hp.  So will different harm spells.  How about a fog spell.  Well if it brings a fog what will happen?  Can we make it so that it causes arrows to miss their targets more?

We don't have the stats system to know what we can and can't do.  I vote that we wait on the spells.  And figure out in stone how we want stats.

[nate]

I'm sorry if that last message doesn't fit.  Maybe I have been looking at this world from a programming perspective too long.

Anyway to contribute to the spell issue.  Consider the range of spells.  Not how far they reach but by who they effect.  Do spells effect a region of land, like a storm, darkness,  do they effect objects(people and things), such as teleportation, bless, flamestrike, or are they global, for example a spell that causes Dark magic to use more mana.  Each spell should have a counter spell.  Every spell needs a counter, the counter doesn't have to be a spell.

For example...
A bard may be able to play a song of silence and storms will soon disipate.  Heavenly light shining down because of the prayers of a priest.  Teleportation requiring movement points as well as mana, dispel magic to remove a blessing, magic reflection to reflect a flamestrike, dispell global enchantment.

My icq is 20748554 if you have any questions or comments.

[Artimidor Federkiel]

If you can let me take a look at the database, Nate, I can take a look on it and think on how we can perhaps integrate the spells in Santharia/Sorren.

[Xarl]

If you want to see some spells, I can make 'em. A question: should there be ingredients for these spells?

[SmurfStormcrow]

Well, it might depend on the race that is casting the spells. As I see it, some races rely on different methods of spellcasting, potions being one of them.

Stormcrow

Psychotic Wizard-Type

[Artimidor Federkiel]

Well, we still need to agree on general ideas. Do we use ingredients? Or runes? For which kind of magic what (elemental, Xeuá or one or two different ways like life magic for example)? You could perhaps start on two or three minor spells (please try to integrate everything I've mentioned in my longer post somewhere on how spells should look like), describe them in detail - not only 2 lines -, then we could use these spells as first examples which we then can start to improve till everything sounds fine, categorize it etc.

[Tarquet Galbar]

Maybe it shouldn't rely on the race, but on the spell. If you're casting a spell that, for example, changes something's size then you might draw a rune on it to perform the spell, while as if you're casting a spell to make something catch on fire you throw some coal dust on it. Just my thoughts.

"Shut It!"-Ancient Illinoisian Saying

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