Brainstorming: Levels and Titles

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[Mina]

Okay, I've procrastinated on this long enough, I think.  I've probably had this idea for months, and it's been going nowhere since then.  But I think it's pretty good, so I'm posting what I have here and hoping that you guys can help with completing it.  

Levels:
The basic idea is that in addition to being a general measure of raw power, levels are defined by what a mage could do.  Obviously, this works best from levels 1-6, before graduation, and only for Ximax-trained magi.  For others, it can mostly just be used as a means of approximately describing their power.  I guess what I'm going to post here is sort of my idea of what Ximax teaches at what time.  

So, we know that Sphere 1 is taught from level 1 onwards, mostly from levels 1-3.  Thus,
Level 1: Conjures the physical form of the element, eg. Rise Flame or Conjure Wind, and whatever spiritual equivilent.  
Level 2: Selecting of individual properties, eg. creating light without heat (though narrowing it down to one property might take more than one level to learn).  
Level 3: Uhm...either I haven't come up with anything or I've forgotten what I wanted to put here.  Any suggestions?  

Sphere 2 is taught from level 4 onwards, mainly during levels 4-6.  But, have I mentioned that I'm not very familiar with Sphere 2?  So, uh, I'm not exactly sure how they might be divided up.  

Sphere 3 would be from level 7 onwards.  I see 4 variants of Sphere 3.  
3a. Adding of ounia, then applying Sphere 1.  
3b. Adding of ounia, then applying Sphere 2.  
3c. Re-linking of ounia, ie. breaking of all the links of the ounia of one element, then re-linking the ounia in a different manner to produce the desired effect.  This is the least that needs to be done in order to produce a permanent enchantment, IMO.  
3d. Adding of ounia, then applying 3c.  Very powerful, needed for most permanent enchantments, IMO.  

The question is, how do we divide these up into levels?  Is there even a rigid structure to learning magic after level 6?  Do we go from 7-10 in the order listed above?  I feel that 3a and 3b could be learnt in the same level though, since the only new thing would be how to add (or remove, for that matter) ounia to a car'all.  3c would be something quite new, and probably taught after 3a and 3b, though I see no poblem with teaching it before the other two either, frankly.  3d requires knowledge of all the previous techniques, and so has to come after them all.  

Also, should level 11 be opened up to non-archmagi?  At that point, I think that levels are only useful as a guage to power, and I can certainly see a few non-archmagi getting as powerful as the archmagi.  On the other hand, level 11 could be a sort of honourary title for archmagi, since we're going to use titles anyway.  The normal levels would be from 1-10 then.  11, whatever it gets called in the future, would be a title exclusive to archmagi.  12 would be a relatively modern term, used to refer to extremely powerful magi from long ago.  

Titles:
And now we come to titles.  My idea is that titles for each level is based on what magi of each level are expected to be able to do.  So, perhaps level 1 magi would be called something like 'conjurer'.  It also seems logical that Ximax would use Styrash titles.  Arti mentioned in a past titles discussion that the title 'xeua'tan' is found on the site, though there is no definition for it.  Since it was used to refer to an archmage, perhaps the 'tan' element could be the 'archmage title'.  Or, it could be a more generic term, meaning something like 'mage'.  

Well, that's all I've got.  I hope you guys could come up with something good.    

[so orril miesefer]

I think in Sphere 2 teachs to make soór or ahm the element, and don't have a specific order to be teached.

sphere 3: I think that would go this way:

3a&3b = 7
3c = 8&9
3d = 10

because the first two are easy learnt only require one level, the second requires two levels since is something very new and the las would be a requirement to become Archmage.

Titles: I think is a good idea, but every element would have their own titles.

[Rayne (Alýr)]

Need to get to bed, but I'll look at this soon.

[Emváy]

This was just a thought I had on the titles thing you had mentioned Mina. I know that it needs alot of Santharian edits and such but .... I had it written down thus far. Ideas, edits and such are welcome to this as I am sure there are others that have better input on some of the schools than I do. I tried to keep the Styrash in it to a minimum, since the elves no longer attend the school frequently. But other than that, just some basic ideas IMHO.

Fire School Titles
1: Ember Apprentice
2: Cinder Apprentice
3: Fiery Adept
4: Scorcher
5: Searing Hand
6: Infernos Adept
7: Flame Spreader
8: Firestorm Initiate
9: Blistering'tan
10: Ruby'tan
11: Teki Arch'tan
12: Phoenix'tan Conjurer
Water School Titles
1: Eddy Apprentice
2: Sodden Apprentice
3: Vortex Adept
4: Wave Shifter
5: Chilling Hand
6: Tidal Adept
7: Frozen Whisperer
8: Roaring Initiate
9: Glacial'tan
10: Xazure'tan
11: Uderza Arch'tan
12: Icy'tan Seeker
Wind School Titles
1: Zephyr Apprentice
2: Sky Apprentice
3: Gusting Adept
4: Storm Bringer
5: Wind-sheer Hand
6: Cyclone Adept
7: Hurricane Herald
8: Tempest Initiate
9: Thunder'tan
10: Cyhalloi'tan
11: Pearlescent Arch 'tan
12: Gale'tan Sorcerer
Earth School Titles
1: Gravel Apprentice
2: Rock Apprentice
3: Earthen Adept
4: Tremor Song
5: Stone Hand
6: Marble Adept
7: Seismic Harbinger
8: Granite Initiate
9: Metal'tan
10:  Ithild'tan
11: Moonsilver Arch'tan
12: Mithril'tan Crafter

~Bows Gracefully and Departs~

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Edited by: Twen  Araerwen  at: 3/27/06 7:28

[Rayne (Alýr)]

Spere two is essentially just moving ounia around to create more of an effect, so maybe...

2a: Move all the ounia of one element together to increase its power in a given car'all
2b: Move all the ounia of one element away from each other to decrease the power of that element
2c: Perhaps preparing a car'all to respond to a certain catalyst i.e. setting up a person's wind ounia in such a way so that when they take a drink of water they become chilled. I'm just stipulating here.

All the teachings with magic will end up blending a little bit, but I would suggest that a mage gets his Introduction to Sphere Two class during late level 2, early level 3 where he'll be "pushing" and "pulling" oun around, then seeing the effects.

I don't want to reserve enchantments for only those with level 10. I would say level 8 or maybe even high level 7 should be able to do enchantments.

As for the level 11 thing... Well, the theory behind this is that level 11 is actually impossible for anyone to reach. You can work your but off, but 10 is as far as any one person can naturally go. Only through an encounter with the Orb can you bump up to level 11. How the Chosen got so powerful, no one really knows (but, as I recall, they were considered clerics, so...)

As for titles, I do like the idea of using Styrash names. Perhaps this project will include putting a few more words in the dictionary!

[Emváy]

Quote:
As for titles, I do like the idea of using Styrash names. Perhaps this project will include putting a few more words in the dictionary!

I really didn't try to integrate much Styrash into the title list outside of what Mina had mentioned above. Since the school has changed to not being a training place for elves, I see little reason for it to be heavily influenced with Styrash IMHO. But if you have some reasoning behind the Styrash influence I would be glad to try and integrate more of it for you Rayne. I am certain that with at least a few elven teachers over the years in Ximax, there is an  influence of Styrash. But I wouldn't say that it would be completely done in this language, if much at all.

Your analogies of how the spheres are done is completely correct IMHO.

~Bows Gracefully and Departs~

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Edited by: Twen  Araerwen  at: 3/27/06 18:45

[Rayne (Alýr)]

Styrash is like the latin of Santharia--its a language that has more than just ancient or denotative significance. The language itself is infused with magical properties, which is why we use styrash for spell incantations. The magical properties of the very language itself is why I suggest we try to carry the Styrash through to the names of the levels.

I like the lists you've given, though, Twen. Perhaps each level can have multiple names--the Styrash ones are just the "official" names of each level (just like how degrees are often completely in latin, even though latin is hardly known and even less used) . The names you gave might serve to be the more popular names of each level.

[Emváy]

I do like your idea as far as Styrash being like latin in Santharia. Possibly a list of the Styrash names would be a nice addition as well. I will get to work on them when I have a few extra moments, yet some help from a Styrash expert might be needed. As my understanding of the language is small in comparison to many. Maybe you could aid me in this area Lady Rayne?

~Bows gracefully and departs~

•´¯¨˜°º°†he §pe££ ƒe££ Üpon the Çrowd £ike a Ðragon, ancien† and ƒu££ oƒ dea†h.°º°˜¨¯`•

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Edited by: Twen  Araerwen  at: 3/27/06 18:54

[Rayne (Alýr)]

I'd be glad to help out where I can. And actually, Twen, I would say that you're probably the fourth most proficient Styrash scholar currently on the boards.  Not many people actually try to learn Styrash, because it is a bit complicated. Artimidor jokingly suggested a "Styrash for Dummies."  

[Silfer Darkflare]

Yes please! Styrash in a nutshell, by O'Rayne  

[Rayne (Alýr)]

Haha. It's actually pretty easy when you get the hang of it. dependent clauses and such are a little bit more difficult, and I'm still working on albative cases. The hardest part of just simple structure is probably the declination of nouns, but once you figure out what's what, it's not so bad.

[Mina]

Styrash would probably be easy, if Arti had presented it in a manner that was easier to understand.  It doesn't look all that complicated, just very poorly presented.  If you have anything resembling a Styrash reference grammar or course, I'm definitely interested.  

However, what's this about Styrash being a magical language?  I fail to see how a language could have magical properties.  It could, perhaps, be better than any other language around at expressing certain concepts needed in magic, but certainly not be the cause of magical effects itself.  

As for the division of Sphere 2, couldn't moving ounia together and moving ounia away be taught together?  I don't quite understand how the 2c suggested here works.  I can see something similar being done with Sphere 3 (3c), but not with Sphere 2.  

Quote:All the teachings with magic will end up blending a little bit, but I would suggest that a mage gets his Introduction to Sphere Two class during late level 2, early level 3 where he'll be "pushing" and "pulling" oun around, then seeing the effects.

I think the idea of Sphere 2 being taught at level 4 and Sphere 3 being taught at level 7 was first suggested by Silfer and then Arti gave it his support.  I think it does make sense though, at least in terms of the complexity of each sphere, especially Sphere 3.  

For the teaching of Sphere 3, I'm thinking maybe it can be something like this:
level 7: either adding of ounia (leading to 3a and 3b), or re-linking (3c).
Level 8: whichever one they didn't pick at level 7
By the time they finish level 8, they should be able to combine both, allowing them to perform 3d.  

Quote:As for the level 11 thing... Well, the theory behind this is that level 11 is actually impossible for anyone to reach. You can work your but off, but 10 is as far as any one person can naturally go. Only through an encounter with the Orb can you bump up to level 11. How the Chosen got so powerful, no one really knows (but, as I recall, they were considered clerics, so...)

Yes, I know that's how it's been for quite a while.  However, I'm failing to see why direct exposure to the Orb could permanently increase one's power.  The Orb's effect is to increase the power of any spell cast near it.  I can see, perhaps, the Archmage of Xeua and the Archmage of Ecua working together to make use of their increased power near the Orb to alter the car'all of a new Archmage to increase his or her power, but that's assuming that the power of a mage is dependent on his car'all's structure.  

The Chosen weren't considered clerics, as far as I know.  Religion hadn't become that organised then.  Certain legends, however, claim that each of the Chosen were gifted with their incredible power by one of the gods, to serve as their proxy on Caelereth (though the Chosen is not necessarily aware of this).  That'd be why they aren't clerics as we know it: their powers were given unconditionally (as far as anyone knows anyway).  

Edited by: Mina Aylwin at: 4/3/06 2:07

[so orril miesefer]

The Orb is solid, liquid or gas? if isn't solid, then someone can drink or breath from it, leaving him death or Chosen. For a very good reason the Orb is so protected, an Archmage becomes Archmage there, but can become Chosen if he/she reached a deep conection with magic.

This is just another crazy theory, but sounds cool.

[Rayne (Alýr)]

Quote:Yes, I know that's how it's been for quite a while. However, I'm failing to see why direct exposure to the Orb could permanently increase one's power.

How is works is a mystery. Unfortunately, not everything in Santharia can be completely explained. This is one of those things.

Quote:The Chosen weren't considered clerics, as far as I know. Religion hadn't become that organised then.

Actually, it had become organized. That's where the jealousy among the Gods spawned: "Finally a high priestess named Kásh'áv'talylá turned the elves away from the other Gods and caused much more jealousy among them than they had ever felt before."

Quote:Certain legends, however, claim that each of the Chosen were gifted with their incredible power by one of the gods, to serve as their proxy on Caelereth (though the Chosen is not necessarily aware of this). That'd be why they aren't clerics as we know it: their powers were given unconditionally (as far as anyone knows anyway).

I don't think is matters whether or not the power was given unconditionally or not. They were still clerics in that their powers came from Gods and did not originate within themselves.  

[Mina]

@Orril: The Orb is none of those.  It's probably not matter as we know it.  I started a thread some time ago to try determine what the nature of the Orb was, and one of the better ideas we came up with was that it was a region of Void.  Of course, this doesn't explain its properties.  I also think that you might have gotten a little infatuated with the Chosen.  Remember that they are mythical figures, and do not concern magic development much.  

@Rayne: The Orb being so important to Ximax (it was founded because of it, after all), I think one of the first things they'd have tried to explain was the Orb.  Theories that couldn't explain the Orb would have been rejected, instead of being developed to something as complex as what we've got.  

Well, I see you're using the other definition of cleric.  I guess you could think of it that way, but then they're not so different from magi anyway.  However, do remember that most of the information about the War of the Chosen came from elven legends, and are probably not all that reliable.  The people in later times might have linked the Chosen with certain gods, based on some attributes they showed, but the Chosen themselves might not necessarily have thought of themselves that in way.  Besides, there are mentions of powerful magic users and warlords warring amongst themselves before and during the time of the War, and it's quite possible that the few most powerful amongst them were later thought by people to have been 'chosen' by the gods, which in time became the legends about the Chosen.  But the history during this period is fuzzy and too confused with mythology anyway, so I guess there isn't much point thinking too much about this.  

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