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Author Topic: Oxen Pack Mount Pic  (Read 13384 times)
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Jonael Tomeskrift
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« Reply #15 on: 24 June 2009, 05:12:46 »

The grass still looks picturesque to me, and it looks like he is missing his back two legs. Other than that, looks great!

Haha, picturesque, 'cause that part 's still a photograph.. I'm still gathering an imageboard for the background, so i haven't taken out that part of the photograph.. which leads to the second point: The two legs are the hardly recognisable dips at the back. Its right hind leg is the one going forward, while the left one continues on closely from its hind edge. Thanks for pointing those out though, cause if they're not that clearly identifyable I need to go at them again ^^ They don't show a lot though cause this is a very hairy cow, so I was trying to convey that its fleece reaches the floor, pretty much covering their legs.. similar to the Musk Ox

I was going to have the animal trudge through thick snow though, the occasionaly yellow grass sprouting out through it.. tundra like? So the lower part, the legs will probably eventually end up covered in snow

Thanks Kalina hug I'm really happy you like it so far
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Artimidor Federkiel
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« Reply #16 on: 24 June 2009, 05:51:56 »

Picture looks pretty good so far - the beast as such and the saddle part as well! Hope the legs and the grass stuff are next, then we're getting a major step towards completion already. First serious drawing attempts take its time to find the proper techniques and stuff, but so far you've done really well, Jonael!
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Tharoc Wargrider
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« Reply #17 on: 24 June 2009, 05:56:46 »

Having tried in vain to coax any kind of acceptable images from a copy of Photoshop that I 'aquired', I can have nothing but admiration for those of you who manage to unravel its complexities. Me, I'll stick to my pencils and biro, thank you very much.

I'll leave proper commentage until nearer the end, Jonael. Suffice to say, you're doing a fine job so far! It's just how I would imagine such a mount, and the saddle is tremendous.
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Jonael Tomeskrift
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« Reply #18 on: 05 July 2009, 07:44:56 »

*huff puff* .. what a tedious thing backgrounds are! None the less I'm not stepping down just yet.

I just wanted to ask my fellow Artists about the snow:

What technique would you recomend to achieve a snow like in this here image?

So far I've tried laying down the colours in rough <brush> strokes, and then using the <smudge> tool to fade them into eachother... but it still looks too jagged and off. Would you guys know of another method to approach it?
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« Reply #19 on: 05 July 2009, 11:48:27 »

I would do just as you are suggesting.  Try adjusting the smudge rate,  I prefer a low rate to allow for more complete blending.
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Jonael Tomeskrift
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« Reply #20 on: 29 July 2009, 02:39:06 »

Wee update on this image. Being up at the castle without internet I've had plenty of time to give this bloody snow another shot. I'm not too satisfied with how it turnd out, but that's why I've once agian turned to my artistic buddies here. Suggestions welcome

grin Befitting the mountainous landscape I decided to go for a panoramic shot
« Last Edit: 29 July 2009, 02:41:09 by Jonael Tomeskrift » Logged

Irid alMenie
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« Reply #21 on: 29 July 2009, 02:56:57 »

While I'm hardly artistic, here's my two sans:

When I make this picture larger, the snow looks fuzzy. It's like you took a picture of the beast and made the background blurred and out-of-focus. In my experience, snow (and especially snow that has been lying around for a few days, getting to the point where it feels more like ice than like snow when touching it) looks really quite sharp.

Conversely, when the picture is in the small thumbnail size, it looks a lot better, with the bits of brown where the snow didn't cling and the bits of blue where there's shadow, so not complaining about the colours at all, just about the sharpness :)

Edit: I looked at it again and your ox looks like it was dumped in the middle of the snow by a giant hand - there's no trail behind him to show that he moved through the snow of his own accord :)

I hope this helps a little bit ^.^
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Irid al'Menie
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« Reply #22 on: 29 July 2009, 03:06:23 »

This mostly looks pretty cool, Jonael - I guess there's nothing you can't fix now, and the key elements to complete the picture have progressed already very far! thumbup

To the details: The ox itself is very well done, maybe some single hairs here and there at the end and at the front to make it look more natural. The fact that he's in the snow, covering the legs was a pretty cool idea, I'd just suggest to at least make a better hint at the legs, e.g. make part of the center of the body a bit above the snow, so that you have at the impression that he's actually standing. I guess you should also remove some snow behind the animal, otherwise it seems like it's been dropped of a helicopter or something... The transition between animal and snow also has some blurs, this should also be worked on.

The weakest part is still the landscape, which is very blurry at parts, so it should be primary objective to remove some of these problems and make it sharper, maybe even work with some textures of stones and snow you find on the site in that other thread I mentioned (ah, here's the site).

But so far this is really impression, Jonael! We should lock you more often in the castle's dungeons if you prefer the quiet of being in a castle... Aura +1!

P.S. And as I can see Irid has just posted and noticed just the same things... :D
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« Reply #23 on: 29 July 2009, 03:48:20 »

Aha I knew you could do it Jonael.  The beast itself is very well done.  The background is really good too.  Very nice.  You probably made the way-back part out-of-focus on purpose to show it is in the back..of course.  But I agree it needs to be sharper.  I got nailed on that in my first few drawings.  While photgraphs can appear that way, we don't want the paintings to be too much out of focus.

Your doing great, it will be worth the effort when it gets posted. thumbup
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« Reply #24 on: 29 July 2009, 04:55:38 »

Bravo!   This is looking quite detailed and professional already - a huge leap from the last version I saw, and obviously a lot of work and care has gone into it.

A couple of suggestions: bright sunlit snowy landscapes reflect a lot of light.  Shadows on the beast could use more contrast - don't be afraid to use your burn and dodge brushes (shadow, darken, whatever they are called) to give some deeper modeling around the eye socket, under the bead bridle, and at the edge of the saddle.   More loose, sharp hairs around the edge of the animal, as Art pointed out, but also some over top of the fur that aren't as blurry (they will resemble guard hairs over the softer pelt beneath, give definition and suggest depth of the fur).  Make sure to 'blur' in the tops of those hairline strokes, though, so that they have an origin and direction.     Horns could have a bit stronger striation, in line with that 'contrast' comment above.

Great design and proportions, love the colour choice....even the pose is so reminiscent of all those old etchings of prize livestock on display, I almost expect to see a plaque or handwritten scribble beneath:  "Norsideye Brawler II, out of Shoulder Brawler and Hoofdancer Matron, 200 hebs.  ColdComfort Steppes Ranch, 1618"...  :)
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Jonael Tomeskrift
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« Reply #25 on: 29 July 2009, 17:41:52 »

Fist off, thank you so much to all of ya for the positive and encouraging feedback. Its just the right thing to keep on going when those difficult snags come up. 

@Irird, artistic or not, I always appreciate your oppinion greatly ^^ Indeed the snow's fuzzy and blurred.. I guess I need to try using a more defined brush that fades less along the edges. My initial concern was that the different shades and colours wouldn't bland nicely which is why I went for a high fading brush. As you and Arti suggest though, I'll give a more defined brush a shot tho.

The reason why I didn't put tracks is because of the nature of the animal I was referencing off. The Musk Ox.. these animals usually stand around (albeit in packs) in the snow for long periods of time, so that the snow swamps nicely about them, covering their tracks. Regardless, I must have forgoten about the tracks, but given the weather conditions I've represented in the illustration though, crisp icy snow seems like a better idea though, so that'll be changed too, ta

@Art, Aye, I'll do somethign to give a clearer impression of the legs. It means a lot that you'd find this impressive, ta much. Haha, as for the castle.. I'm working up there 'till end of august, so still plenty of time to enjoy the solitude and peaceful ease.

@Seeker, haha, thanks. Yeah 'once it gets posted'.. There is no entry for it yet though. The idea was really just to see what the art community here thought of the new art skills I'd brushed up. But I guess I could look into making and entry for it too. Or if someone else feels inspired, go for it ^^

@Judy, Thanks Judy, though I can't really say I spent a lot of time on it since the last version (one evening I think it was) I did indeed put a lot of passion and effort into this newest version. I'm absolutely loving this illustrating and art-ing! As for the shadows, I'll get right to them.

Haha, as for the prize livestock pose.. that might have slipped in subconciously. Having royal family history, the castle's seeded with some Impressive paintings of Prize Derby Horses, I've actually spent quite some time looking at and into them by now, so that might have seeped through. I'm really proud and happy it seems as such though. It seems an appropriate pose for this majestic mount grin
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Deklitch Hardin
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« Reply #26 on: 29 July 2009, 18:17:21 »

Jonael, I too am impressed with what you've done here. I'm enjoying seeing the way you are progressing through the stages of developing the pictures as well as reading your discussion of what you are attempting to do with each new version you put up for feedback.

I'm also enjoying reading the feedback others are giving to you with regards to yout efforts ... that is also helping my understanding of the process one goes through with something like this. At the moment, I tend to be more skilled with floor plans and such things than with pictures ... but I suppose everyone has to start somewhere, don't they.

In any case, +1 aura from me, Jonael for your progress and the way you are taking on the suggestions of others.

- Dek
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Jonael Tomeskrift
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« Reply #27 on: 29 July 2009, 18:43:16 »

Spot on Deklitch, I find it important to convey the thinking behind some of the things that go on in the ilustration. Sometimes they justify something in the image, but mostly it's just interesting to know about. Things aren't just in there cause they came out that way, but because there was a cart of thought (train would be a little too advanced for Santharia just yet) behind them.. I'm glad you enjoy and apreciate the commentary as much as I do grin And your right about progress too, gotta start with something small but that you feel confident with, and then each time maybe try out something new, a daring step into the new and maybe unattempted by you. That's how I got into painting this fella.. and then had to go on to face my fear of backgrounds, haha.

In any case, ta for the +aura, and lets both keep at it striving to improve
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Alysse the Likely
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« Reply #28 on: 30 July 2009, 03:30:56 »

I think he's beautiful.  I do have one suggestion, though.  With the trappings, this is obviously a domesticated beast, but there are no signs of civilization of any around him.  He looks like he is alone in the wild. 

I'm not recommending any complicated changes, so don't worry.  I was thinking of possibly something to indicate people being around.  The edge of a stone fence or side of a building in the distance, maybe even just the tracks of a person leading away (like he stopped for a break in his trip)  Or maybe you have something else in mind.

Lovely work, Jonael!

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Alysse the Likely
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« Reply #29 on: 30 July 2009, 06:12:39 »

A break, huh?  I guess oxentrekking gets hard on the bladder after a while.....
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