Weavers

Rayne (Alýr)

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Weavers

« on: 07 February 2006, 16:16:00 »

Oh, Ava, what have I gotten myself into...?

Ok, when I was at Santhmoot for an unsatifactorily short time (next time I go to Germany, I'm staying three weeks, or three months, not three days!) we discussed Weavers, and sort of discovered that the entries were a little bit out-of-date, and we came up with a more likely story for them.

I've sort of taken that discussion and expanded it. I haven't really re-read this and most of it (*ahem* all of it) I wrote offline off of notes, so I don't know how much of this stuff is right or relevent. I don't have a lot of time (I did this when I was supposed to be studying) and need to get to bed to get enough sleep for class tomorrow. I'll try to re-read it or get to correcting it this weekend (maybe).

If I should add anything, please tell me and I'll get right on it.

... I'm already seeing things I need to add. I have an exam Friday. :crazy

Weavers

“Whatever was once known of the Weavers is now gone. What glorious cities they may have built, what kingdoms they might have constructed, what culture they may have developed, is lost to us. They have spun their tales out of our history, weaved themselves out of our existence.” –Adarin Mortare, human sage from Ximax, Myth and Lore Tower

Weavers are a mysterious group of mages living on the Web, the realm of magic. Weavers have dwelled in a world of myth for as long as anyone can remember, and for as long as there has been a written and spoken history. Most of the tales of Weavers have been passed down through generations, through the flickering shadows of time that has no doubt distorted and changed the truth. No one knows for sure if the weavers still exist, or if they ever existed, but various cultures, both past and present, have known of them, and have looked to them with awe, suspicion, or fear of the power they are said to posses.

The name “Weavers” comes from this extraordinary power—the power to weave spells out of raw magic (also called resonance magic or simply “weaver magic”).

Origin: The oldest pieces of scriptures (found in the Great Library of the Aellenrhim) either as pieces of fact or myth, assume the Weavers were, at one time, known throughout Caelereth, among all the races, but this marks back to the Age of Myth, when Gods and Goddesses were also believed to have walked the earth. The scripture, written in ancient, almost untranslatable styrash, seems to treat the presentation of Weavers in close correspondence with that of the Gods in terms of power and influence, and in some ways implies that the Weavers shared, not only a formidable power when the world of Caelereth was still new, but, in some ways, also their immortality. This may indirectly assume that the Weavers were not a creation of the Aviaria, but were dreamt into the world by Ava herself.

The briefness and vagueness of their mention, however, may be the cause of the Weavers relative mystery and anonymity in the modern days. Whatever prominence they had before the War of the Chosen is gone now, and whatever society they cultivated, whatever culture they developed, vanished with them. The incredible destruction that is said to have occurred during the War of the Chosen may explain why many documents noting the Weavers is missing. That is, if the Weavers ever existed in the first place, which some doubt.

The elven myth (paralleling some ancient orcish tales) marks the Weavers as vanishing before the war of the chosen. Researchers and travelers who have returned from contact with the orcs alive brought back with them, not only important research of the cultures, but vague and often bias accounts of the events of Fá'áv'cál'âr. The orcs, only in the most detailed stories, note that during the turbulent times when religious focus began to change (which eventually lead to the great city’s downfall) ‘silent mages with ungodly powers’ suddenly vanished, and it was a sign that a darkness, a chaos, was about to fall.

The elven scripture tends to be a little less vague and provide more reason. Many Weavers lived in Fá'áv'cál'âr, and all admired the city for its beauty and light, and they dwelled there, and in many other places in Caelereth. Before the War of the Chosen, even before Kásh'áv'taylá took the throne, Ava sent a message to “her blessed and burdened children” that they were to leave this plain as a great battle, a destined battle, was to occur, and they must hide away. “The Weavers gathered then together from all corners of Caelereth, congregated with hearts leaden with uncried tears and faces solemn as the autumn clouds, and together spoke upon the message Ava had sent them and decided this world could never again be their own, and they together wove in tandem a city and a place outside the world, behind the sky, beyond the farthest dying star, where they could live forever watching the mortals and forever guarding the course of fate and time. This place came to be called the Web.

And there they watched as the Chosen lay havoc upon the blessed garden Ava dreamt into being, where they killed the delicate creatures Ava had dreamt into life, and she cried and the Weavers cried with her from their remote kingdom far away. But no wars last forever, and the Chosen fell at last and the world was left in desolate peace. But the fabric of the dream, the fabric that had kept closed all pathways to the world of Nether [Netherworld] had grown thin, and beasts of war-like tendency threatened the weak and suffering world.

It was then that Ava called again on the Weavers, and she asked them to weave the fabric of the dream hole again, to keep the beasts of the worlds beyond away from the precious and peaceful world of Caelereth, and they bowed their heads and pledged their lives to weave forever the fraying threads of the dream. Eternally the Beasts of Nether pine and claw to enter into the world of Caelereth, and eternally the Weavers weave to keep it safe.”

The Web: The Web is the so-called home of the Weavers, though controversy over its location has puzzled scholars and sages for centuries. The oldest scripture notes the Web as being in another dimension, some place “outside the world, behind the sky, beyond the farthest dying star.” The Web is in another dimension, one created purely of magic, where the Weavers may watch mortal, but never meddle in their affairs or influence their chosen paths.

However, some sailors and explorers claim to have seem the Web with their own eyes. They say that it is a small island, though the location varies from person to person. The majority place the Web in a remote span of ocean between the Southern coast of Santharia, the eastern coast of Nybelmar, and the northern coast of Aeruillin. Some say the island is closer to Denilou. Few have claimed to have seen in off the western coast of Santharia, and none have said that the Web is anywhere more northward than the Tandala Mountains (though, admittedly, few have dared to travel more northward than that).

Sighting have all varied, but one notable feature in all the stories is that no sailor was ever able to reach the shores of the island they claimed to see. Either by storm or strange wind, or by suspicions of the captain, the island was avoided. The accounts bare the qualities of a fanciful tale, with mists surrounding the whole island, towers reaching up past the clouds, and ghostly shadows dwelling along the shore. The Web, by any means, is still considered by most to be in another dimension and to have no bearing in this world. It is a place created, weaved, purely from magic.

Modern Myth: Although the origins of the Weavers is told most explicitly through the ancient elven scriptures, many other races and cultures have incorporated the Weavers into their beliefs. Though the opinion of the Weaver differs, the name and many of the characteristic of the weavers seem to permeate across cultural and geographical boundaries.

Aeruillin: A number of tribes on the continent of Aeruillin believe in the existence of the Weavers. The most notable is the Hjoria, who are known to be avid believers in fae. Their knowledge of the Weavers perhaps originally came from the Cholian, though no one is entirely sure how they came to have such knowledge. The Hjoria strongly believe that the Weavers are a group of fae given incredible powers of darkness by Polmaen, but also accidentally given more than their share of chaos and evil. They believe that these dark fae are kept contained on their island by Nakashi, who protects the world from the destruction they could cause.

Though the Weaver myth isn’t a primary part of the Hjoria’s religion, they have, at some points, chosen to portray the Weaver in artwork. The Weavers are not portrayed as humanoid beings, but merely semi-sentient, with human heads and eight pairs of legs, and then two pairs of dark wings layered on their back. The figures are frightening and almost grotesque, and many scholars and art-sages see the portrayals as indication that the Hjoria were given little more than the name and quality of the Weavers, and have attached their own vivid imaginations to distort the Weavers into such forms.

The Cholian have a more passive view of the Weavers, one they share with the Avennorians, and with many of the other tribes of their own continent with whom they trade, such as the Rhulrans. The Weavers are seen as little more than ghostly spirits that contain vast amounts of magic. They are seen as cursed souls that wander upon the island of their captivity, lost and dangerous if approached. Their creation isn’t explained by the Cholian beliefs—the Weavers simply are, and have always been, since there has been such as thing as magic and death.

Nybelmar: Many of the cultures of Nybelmar have ignored the myths of Weavers. Many of the human tribe believe the Weavers only exist in silly beliefs and exaggerated tales. However, tribes such as the Murmillions seem to buy into the myth. By Murmillion belief, the Weavers are part of the force that opposes Mari, Goddess of Dreams. They are seem as minions of “The Unspoken,” and are creations of Mari’s spouse, the Dark God from beyond the world. Though their origins are agreed upon, the purpose of the Weavers and their part in the destiny of the world differs. Some believe the Weavers are weaving a portal from which the Dark God will arise and swallow the world into nothingness. Others claim the Weavers are constantly spinning things out of existence. If something becomes lost, some believe it was the world of a Weaver. The truth is unknown, but the Weavers are looked upon by all Murmillions with suspicion and distrust.

Sarvonia: The word Weaver is all but unknown by many tribes of the north, save for the previously-mentioned orcs and some of the dark elf tribes (in particular the Diorye’oleal). Most of what is believed among the humans of Santharia comes from the Avennorians, who claim to have seen the Web and even the Weavers themselves. Similar to the Cholians of Aeruillin, the Avennorians claim that they are dangerous and ghost-like apparitions, though most believe they are living and not just souls. Their physical appearance is said to be one of ghastly thinness. Their hair is almost white, they claim, and their bodies are boney and thin. They have long, slender fingers and yellow nails and their eyes are deep-sunken and empty.

As in all cultures, the Avennorians claim that the Weavers are powerful mages, and that it is their magic that keeps them alive though they be hundreds or thousands of years old. Many claim they are evil and dangerous creatures, without morals and without heart, who would rail the winds to blow a ship to pieces if it so pleased them, without blinking an eye or caring about the lives lost. They live forever and can not understand the value of life.

To the dwarves, though, talk of Weavers only incites grins and hearty laughs, as the race of dwarves think little on such things of myth, and put no faith into such beliefs.

The human sages and scholars who have studied the scripture and analyzed the myth have drawn their own conclusions about the Weavers. Those they believe such powerful mages do exist claim that they are not immortal, though they are powerful, and are composed of humans, elves, even dwarves, from all over Santharia who are born with the gift to weave. When a child is born who has this gift, the scholars say that the Weavers come and take the child, and then weave the threads of memory as to make everyone forget such a child existed or was to ever exist. The child is then taken to the Web, a mystic place somewhere in another dimension, and trained to, as the myth goes, mend the fabric of the dream—that fabric that separates Caelereth from the Netherworld.

Most of the elves of Sarvonia hold close to the original myth, including the dark elves both in Santharia and in Northern Sarvonia. The Yifferhim, Aellenrhim, Quealhoirhim and Diorye’oleal seem to possess the most knowledge of the Weavers, which the few records left behind by the Cyrathrhim implies the Weavers played a part in their beliefs as well. These elven tribes believe that indeed the Weavers are immortal, created by Ava herself at the time when the light and shadow elves were created. The Weavers are her beloved children of magic, assigned the important task of protecting the world of Caelereth from the creature of the Netherworld by constantly mending the fabric of the dream. The Weavers are said to be neither good nor evil, but neutral powers meant to guard, not a balance necessarily, but rather to maintain the course of destiny in Santharia. They have a wealth of knowledge and power that they are forbidden to share to any mortal—to do so would not only anger Seyella, but would result in, perhaps, their own extinction, weaved by their peers. Their task is merely to weave and help guide fate.

Mending the Fabric: The purpose of the Weavers, as dictated by popular Santharian, scholarly and elven myth is the mending of the fabric of the dream. Before Ava dreamt Caelereth into existence, she closed her eyes and the fabric began to form. From this fabric all of Caelereth was created. On the other side of this fabric exists the Netherworld—a sort of nightmare of Ava, or else some distorted reflection created by her other self, Coor. The Netherworld is a place of darkness and shadow, where creatures powerful and dangerous reside.

The fabric that separates the two dimensions remained pretty much complete until the War of the Chosen, when powerful mages summoned creatures from the Netherworld. This not only weakened the fabric, but also brought the Netherbeasts the knowledge that there was another world, a rather pleasing one, just beyond this fabric. Since this time, monstrous and powerful Netherbeasts have been constantly trying to break through to the other side.

After the war of the chosen, the myth says that Ava asks the Weavers to mend the fabric. This they did, and still do. They have mended the holes that once existed from the War of the Chosen, but the beasts trying to break through along with summoners attempting to summon one of these beasts has caused new weak places in the fabric. The fabric is a dynamic surface that is constantly changing by beasts trying to break free, summoners trying to summon powerful creatures, and the weavers who are constantly repairing the destruction. For this reason, weak points in the fabric rarely remain there for very long, but are mended, so summoners must search for new weak points from which to summon.


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"There is much misjudgment in the world. Now, I knew you for a unicorn when I first saw you, and I know that I am your friend. Yet you take me for a clown, or a clod, or a betrayer, and so I must be if you see me so. The magic on you is only magic and will vanish as soon as you are free, but the enchantment of error that you put on me I must wear forever in your eyes. We are not always what we seem..." -Schmendrick the Magician, The Last Unicorn

Arancaytar Ilyaran

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Re: Weavers

« Reply #1 on: 07 February 2006, 22:51:00 »

Quote:
I have an exam Friday

So have I. :lol

Good luck!

Going to read your entry tomorrow, when I'm done with the exam...

If Fire is Earth desiring to be Wind,
And Water is Wind trying to be Earth,
What then is Fire wishing to be Water?
Santharia, a place of world creation and roleplaying.


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Smith in Exile

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Re: Weavers

« Reply #2 on: 07 March 2006, 13:19:00 »

This is one enchanted entry, Rayne [applause]. Though I see that you still have a bit of a work to do on it. However I would like to comment on the Nybelmarian side of the Weaver myths.

What you describe there about Murmillions makes me think that perhaps their tribe entry would need an update (but we need to settle on a coherent Nybelmar timeline first). However, there are still up on the site their religion entries (The Shadowcasting, Mari, the Cults of Mari and the Arkhaeon Guild). I don't know if I really managed to offer a clear image though. But from that intended general image I guess that we could conclude that this version of the Weaver myth that you describe for Murmillions would be actually, at most, a heresy among them. The thing is that their "Dark God", or "the Unspoken", is not a personified being but more like a principle. He/it creates things just like the black background of this board creates the white words that we read. There is no intention in this sort of creation, as the intention comes only with Mari - and thus she is ultimately their one and only God.
Then there is another thing about Murmillions: they are all truly believing that they do not belong to this world (and thus they are calling it the "world of exile"). So confronted with these Weaver myths I guess they would rather believe that the Weavers must be the holiest of the holiest Murmillions, who finally managed to break out of this world of damnation => their feelings for them would rather tend towards reverence.
And then there is one thing more: the different systems of magic. The Sarvonians have the the Ximaxian one and I suppose that the Weavers are related to the same classification. About the Nybelmarian magic we can only speak in vague terms, since the "new systems" ban. Anyway, I always pictured Murmillions as tinckering with a sort of "mind magic" - this is what suits them after all: power games, altered states of conscience and control. I guess that they would also not really consider it real magic (when they believe that their holy mountains were a result of a magical deed, it's kinda hard to name magic a mere hypnosis), but more like a skill. So the question is how does the Weavers/weaving fit in such a picture?
Perhaps they could believe in some sort of beings that guard all the possible "exits" from the world of exile - aka Weavers in Sarvonia? Hmmmm... this is a bit tricky though. They will eventually end up by considering such beings more like metaphors... I don't know.

But, if the Murmillion version does not work, maybe we can find another place. Like Anis-Anpagan. They have a very influential Mage Guild (the Ansaran mages) and a certain enclave of heretics (the Daedhirians of the Venlaken Enclave). Now the Daedhirians have certainly spawned many Netherworld stories among the Anpagans (see the Asbavaer and Asdamon people entries, the Venlaken Enclave place entry, and the Anpagan Atheism religion entry - for this possible version of the weaver myth), so I see no reason why the Ansaran mages would not produce a theory (probably based upon an original elven Weaver myth) about such a mystery place or such a mystery group of gifted individuals that dwell at the edge of the world. I guess they could even try to explain their Daedhirian "embarassment" through the existence of such persons. After all some Daedhirians tend to look like the Avennorians describe the Weavers, plus Armand Da'Ran, the original Daedhirian, came with his heresy from the eastern seas where "a wise shadow" whispered it into his ears. Of course, the Daedhirian abomination cannot really match those true gifted individuals living on the edge of the world... I don't know, maybe it's a starting point for a better Nybelmarian version of the Weaver myth. (ah, one important thing to keep in mind when dealing with these Ansaran mages: they always ask for viable proofs - until the weavers do not show up in the world, they would consider any theories about them as simple speculations, speculations that might be true, but... speculations

)


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Fluffy Ramblers

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Re: Weavers

« Reply #3 on: 07 March 2006, 14:06:00 »

You should write about some of the rare mysterious encounters, when angry weavers appeared in front of the summoners and had short and polite conversations with them (probably using such heavy indisputable arguments as wooden staves) about holes in the fabric of the Dream being a bad bad thing. *grins*

Do you plan to replace the current entry about weavers or just amplify it, by the way?

P.S. Good luck with the exams, you both.

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Rayne (Alýr)

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Re: Weavers

« Reply #4 on: 07 March 2006, 14:53:00 »

Smith: It would be nice if the Weavers were viewed as the holiest of Murmillions--those who broke free from the "world of exile"--but that would obviously come from the Elvish-santharian myth that proclaims they are beings who vanished from this dimension and created a place of their own in another. Unfortunately, we don't have that line of communication. Most of the myths and tellings that would come to the Murmillions and the other Nybelmarians would come from sailors who professed to have seen the beings on some remote yet unreachable island--those like the Avennorians or maybe a wandering Cholian (less likely, but possible). Those who believe in the original elven myth would have no reason to travel, especially to Nybelmar, where things might get dangerous if you step on the wrong end of the island. The sightings of these powerful magi would imply that the Weavers had not escaped the world of exile, but were still trapped in it, unless you want to somehow play with the idea of their having the power to go back and forth between the world of exile and other worlds. Is that possible? Perhaps they believe that the Weavers are the ones who take the souls of the dead out of the world of exile or something? Or when someone disappears, they say they have left this damned world by way of the Weavers?

There are different systems of magic, and Weaver magic is one of them. Weaver magic does NOT fall into Santharian-Ximaxian magic. It isn't part of the same system. When you study magic at Ximax, you aren't told of threads of magic that can be woven together to create things, unwoven to destroy. This is a system of magic completely separate and wholly unattainable. How and why it works, if it even exists, is purely theoretically. No one truly knows. All we know is what the ancient scriptures have told us, and even they may be metaphorical.

It would be nice to have the Murmillions as part of this entry--I'd like to touch on as many tribes as possible for this. I'm thinking I'd like to expand the views of these specific tribes to include, not only how a tribe explains their existence, but also their appearance and maybe their purpose/influence in the world.

I'll look at some of the Anis-Anpagan entries you mentioned and see if I can't figure anything out--and if you already have something brewing in your mind, let me know! You know more about these tribes than I do, so I definitely need your help for these sections!

Fluffy: If the Weavers appeared, than they would be more known than they are! The Weavers are pretty mysterious and fairly unknown in the modern world--they are known just well enough to find a small part into a lot of belief-systems. Besides, if a Weaver truly wanted to, he/she could weave a summoner out of existence! These are pretty powerful magi!

At this point, I think this entry may replace Tarq's. Tarq's is well-written, but there is no way we could possible know all that about the Weavers. They are mysterious, and yet we know every facet of their society. It's a bit unrealistic. I'm hoping that I can keep that detail, but also relate the ambiguity of the Weaver's existence.

Exam tomorrow! (Aw, my legs and arms and shoulders hurt... and half of the soreness is from carrying groceries!


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Fluffy Ramblers

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Re: Weavers

« Reply #5 on: 07 March 2006, 15:51:00 »

Well, I just thought of an analogy between the Weavers and the extra-terrestrians here in our world. Some of us claim to have seen them, but we still know nothing. *smiles*

Just how powerful are they then? I think even the gods can't simply wipe someone out of the Dream.

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Rayne (Alýr)

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Re: Weavers

« Reply #6 on: 08 March 2006, 01:54:00 »

Can't they? No one really knows, I guess. If they were taken out of existence, then no one would know.

It might be something we could do--people do claim to see pretty strange things. Perhaps random people might claim to see them, but the old elven scriptures do imply that the Weaver's have a pretty restricted existence. They are not to alter the fated course, and are to live outside of the Caelereth world, as guardians and nothing more. I even mentioned somewhere that if a Weaver stepped out of their boundaries they were weaved out of existence and the prohibited weavings they had done were unwoven. But maybe I'm being too strict...


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Fluffy Ramblers

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Re: Weavers

« Reply #7 on: 08 March 2006, 03:44:00 »

Well, the way the gods are discribed, they could probably take someone from the realm of the living into the realm of the dead. But completely wipe them off the Dream?

Now when I think of it... Could Ava just undream a person?

As for those visits... I guess you're right. I just liked the idea that they represent a danger for every summoner, making summoning a bit like stealing - you better not get caught.

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Coren

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Nybelmar

« Reply #8 on: 08 March 2006, 05:04:00 »

I have two tribes to add to the myths, if you don't mind: the Lillivear High Temple and the Orihirim (which I have just started). However, I can't do so before August. Is that ok with you?


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Rayne (Alýr)

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Re: Weavers

« Reply #9 on: 08 March 2006, 05:45:00 »

I guess your right, but I'm still a little hesitant of portraying Weavers like some sort of Secret Police, FBI, or Secret Service oranization. (you're all picturing Weavers as men in sunglasses and suits now, aren't you?) Perhaps it could be a means of jest among summoners or something.

Coren: Of course I can wait! This entry will most likely still be here in August. I want to add a lot more detail to it.


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Fluffy Ramblers

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Re: Weavers

« Reply #10 on: 07 April 2006, 11:17:00 »

No, no secret police, nothing like that.

But imagine you were a Weaver - you know the fabric of Dream is very thin, and you know there are beings on the other side who longed for centuries to break through it and who would wreak havoc as soon as they cross the line. And you put all your efforts to maintain this line - only to watch how another ignorant bearded fool ruins all your work playing with his magic. Would this leave you cold?

I guess, even a Weaver's work at some point can become a routine, but on very rare occasions, when a skilled summoner really endangers Caelereth, it would only be wise to talk to this summoner and ensure he won't repeat his mistake. And for the summoner it probably would be wise not to mention the conversation.

That's how I see it: the Weavers, despite their immortality, are also only humans, whose patience isn't endless.

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Mina

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Re: Weavers

« Reply #11 on: 07 April 2006, 20:15:00 »

Well, the idea of a 'fabric' separating the Dream and the netherworld is pretty confusing to me. Is it a real, physical barrier (assuming the myths to be true, of course) of some kind?

Also, how would summoning creatures from other parts of Caelereth, instead of from the netherworld, affect the fabric?


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Rayne (Alýr)

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Re: Weavers

« Reply #12 on: 08 April 2006, 02:15:00 »

The Fabric isn't physical. The Netherworld is a completely different dimension. Think of it this way: In our real world, we don't have certain places where we walk into a Fabric with a little sign saying "Your Dimension Ends Here." The barrier is purely spiritual. For the most part, The term "fabric" is a metaphor. However, I guess it's been used so often, that it might make people confused.

As for summoning in Caelereth, because no creature is passing through an dimensional barriers, the fabric is uneffected. If there are any barriers separating beasts and summoners in Caelereth, those barriers are not so critical. If the barrier between Caelereth and the Netherworld became too weak, the Netherbeasts would be able to freely pass through, and that might make things a little hectic. The fabric grows thin by beasts being summoned through it, though more so from dangerous beasts trying to break through.