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Author Topic: Mermish *in progress*  (Read 10292 times)
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Viresse
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« Reply #15 on: 16 April 2002, 15:43:00 »

Sorry for not getting around to this. There's been alot going on, and I have been so busy with filling things out... peh. Stop with the excuses, Doyle, and give her tha fraggin' words!

Water

* Merfolk have many words for water. Some are pidgin, and most are sounds that convey an idea rather than a single word. Herein listed will be words for Water. If there is not a translated word beside it, it is assumed that the idea conveyed is intranslatable.*

chaachiioh= windy water ( water currents, stormy weather, passing boats)
taaghuaa
aasuuh = messy water ( dirty, polluted, un-calm)
wehffaalo
maakeeffaa= pretty water ( unsure of exact meaning)
sshaakii
cuul
eenii = water of many fish ( term has no tense; fish HAVE lived there, WILL live there, or ARE there)
mookhaai
caatuu= breeding water (ANY animal which finds the area suitable enough for raising young)
ffuubehh

Also, before I forget, the sea horse is called Chuu'ffeenii in mermish.

My mind is not in language-set right now, this is what I can pump out for the moment. Are there any duplicates of words or something wrong?  

Viresse Sheelala

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Edited by: Viresse at: 4/16/02 12:43:37 am
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« Reply #16 on: 16 April 2002, 17:30:00 »

chaachiioh
naaghuaa   =>  taaghuaa  (change initial n to t)
aasuuh
behfaalo  => wehffaalo (double ff is the hissed, whistling sound between teeth and lower lip and should be incorporated in a number of words)
maakeeraa
shaakii => sshaakii (again, double ss makes a strong breathy sound which I'd like to hear often)
cuul
eenii
mookhaai
caatuu
muubehh

Don't think there are any 'problems' except there is no translation for any of these words!  Are they all 'untranslatable?"  (in which case there is very little point in adding them, right?  (grin))    Also, merfolk won't use initial 'n' sounds, as I said before about the negative ("toh") - so I'd change the one word as above.  

We might also be able to use some words for emotions - which change quickly but are none the less strong in the merfolk.  That's all the time I've got for now, so will comment further later.  Thanks, Viresse!


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 “The three principal endeavors of a Bard are to learn and collect knowledge; to teach others; to make peace and put an end to all injury. To do contrary to these things is not usual or becoming to a Bard.”  
The Triads of Britain, medieval text

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Viresse
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« Reply #17 on: 16 April 2002, 17:35:00 »

Okies. I'll change the inital entry's letters. As for the lack of Translation, yeah, I was going for * intranslatable-ness*. I have thrown in some words that can be translated, but as you can see, they are either vague or VERY precise.

As for Emotions, I hadn't thought about that, guess I was stuck in the animal thinking thing.

Viresse Sheelala

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Edited by: Viresse at: 4/16/02 12:44:21 am
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Viresse
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« Reply #18 on: 16 April 2002, 17:54:00 »

Emotions

* Merfolk emotions change rapidly, it is hard to document the wide range these creatures go through. However, there are some words that describe emotions we know, as well as ones we don't. If there is body language that accompanies these emotions, it will be included in the translation.*

ffewuu = happy ( playful, fidgety)
hwuu = cheerful ( near the same as happy but less so)
chahho = playful ( jumping, twirling, splashing excessively)
ffuuhii = excited ( fidgety, quick movements)
daahuu = amused ( calmness with interest)
paaffoo = enamored ( staring, playfullness, touching)
taafoowii = love ( same as enamored but more intense)
dehooffa =   translation unclear ( smiles, slight aggression)
ffeechii = translation unclear ( flailing of limbs and tail while in water)

ffehoo = bored  (restless, loud sounds, eagerness)
haanii = somber ( laziness, blank expression, seclusion)
dehffoo = sad ( downturned face, similar to somber)
uuriigo = fear (quick movements loud voice, downturned face)
huumuu = depression ( similar to somber, more noticable)
sshuurii = anger ( upturned face, fast movement aggressive behavior)
sshooraa = jealousy ( similar to anger, but less pronounced, and directed toward an individual)
shaahii = frustration ( flailing, downturned face, outbursts of anger)
ffuunhuuii =  unsure ( uncontrollable, violent behavior)
dehiifaa =  unsure ( lashing out at things;living or inatimate)
gahfooruu =  unsure ( sulking heavily, to the point of not doing anything for oneself, even swimming)
heehii =  unsure ( determined look, direct actions)

liiffoo = surprise ( shocked look, upturned face)
chuun = hunger ( tired look, active hunting of food)
sshii = tired ( slow movements, laziness)
ffaanoo = cranky ( over-reacting to things, similar to tired but more active)

That's what I have for now. Anyone else have any ideas?

Viresse Sheelala

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Edited by: Viresse at: 4/16/02 5:58:50 am
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Bard Judith
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« Reply #19 on: 16 April 2002, 21:36:00 »

oooh, love it, Viresse.

Not sure (heehii-type-unsure!) about the word "ffeechii" - sounds a lot like a word we already have, but as I'm not on my home computer I can't look it up.

I really like 'gahfooruh' - the sound is so disgusted....

I would also add a suffix or prefix to all the emotion words to indicate that they are emotions, in the way that we use "to be"  (She IS happy, they ARE angry with each other, etc.)  but non-conjugated.  How about "bi"?  (Cheating, I know, but easy to remember)

I think we agreed that they would use long whistling melodic phrases which (I suggest) we can represent by non-capitalized, hyphenated sentences, to give Mermish a unique look (elven uses a lot of apostrophes, Thergerim uses capitals to distinguish between word parts, humans use spaces, etc...)

So when mermaids speak of emotions they might phrase a sentence thus: " la-bi-dehffoo"   or "she in-state-of sad" (she's sad).  Or possibly "li-toh-bi-ffewuu" - "he-no-in-happy" (he's upset).

By the way, do we have pronouns?  A few simple ones might be useful:

male/he/him/his as one word  = li (pronounced as leee)
female/she/her as one word    = la
neuter/it (third gender of merfolk)   = lo
that creature/it (non-sentient, alive)  = le (pronounced lay)
that thing/it (any inanimate object) = uhff (a quick grunt)

any plural pronoun =   add the word for many to the pronoun.  Thus a group of males, or even two males, would be "many-li", because they hate counting!  Anything over four or five, I'm guessing, will be hard to count....  but perhaps you've worked that out already with number words.

Let me know!
(boy, this is fun!   (Splashes water around happily)

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Viresse
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« Reply #20 on: 16 April 2002, 22:53:00 »

The ideas you have are really cool. I wasn't thinking about the way it would look, being as it's a spoken language, but it's not like we can SPEAK mermish to one another. So the hypens are cool. Does your keyboard have the wavy hyphen?
We could use that to waver between words, making it even MORE unique.

" La~be~dehfoo..."  

How does that look?

Anyway. I was thinking in the merfolk speaking in the plural inclusive "We", but they are going to need to distinguish between the sexes.  I guess when talking to someone NOT merfolk, they would use the ' We'. Is that okay?

Oh... urhm, what IS we.... I think... ffa.

" Ffa~bi~ffewuu ..."

Is that good?

I'll look around for Ffeechii here , and see if it does.

*  *  *

No ffeechii. Not that I saw, There was ffeewuncho, that was the closest I saw.

And I looked things over, and the Unsure term meant that the translation was unclear. Maybe I should mark that.

Viresse Sheelala

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Edited by: Viresse at: 4/16/02 5:56:42 am
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Bard Judith
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« Reply #21 on: 17 April 2002, 08:32:00 »

(blushes) ooops.  I did wonder why there were so many varieties of uncertainty...then I assumed it was because merfolk are very fickle.  Duh.

Thanks for the clarification!

And yes, my keyboard has the 'tilde', or what you called the wavy hyphen (grin).  I think most keyboards would have it, and the wavy shape would be even MORE appropriate for Mermish!  

I forgot 'we' - also used for 'us' and 'our' of course.... 'ffa' works for me in this case; that classic breathy sound!

I don't see why they couldn't also use 'ffa' for referring to oneself when speaking to other mer....the way a child does when trying to convince his mother of something.  "We wanna cookie, mom...." or - a sort of conveniently assumed inclusiveness, like a preteen complaining "EVERYbody's parents let them stay up late...."   I like your concept of them as having something of a group consciousness - not in the strictest sense, such as insects, but more the way in which a flock of birds can make seemingly simultaneous decisions about which way to fly or when to land and feed - a complex awareness of each member of the pod around them in their three-dimensional aquatic space.  Their language should indeed reflect that awareness.

So their sentences might sound like this:  "We are hungry.  (Let) us chase fish!" or "Are we (not) beautiful?  Do not we desire to mate (together)?"   I'd need more vocab to translate the whole thing, but you get the idea.  Words in brackets are implied.

Let's get some more language on the table - especially some grammatical rules and structures....which should be pretty simple.  Vocab can always be added as needed (see the Styrash and Thergerim threads, for example) but we need to let other people in on the overall concepts.

Fun working together with you, Viresse!
Bard Judith

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"Give me a land of boughs in leaf /  a land of trees that stand; / where trees are fallen there is grief; /  I love no leafless land."   --A.E. Housman
 
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« Reply #22 on: 17 April 2002, 14:06:00 »

yeah! I've had fun as well, we seem to think very much along the same lines.

I think, yeah, we should show this stuff off to everyone! Maybe they could help us with other words?

Viresse Sheelala

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Greybark
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« Reply #23 on: 17 April 2002, 19:42:00 »

Enjoying watching, but no ideas of my own yet.


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Bard Judith
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« Reply #24 on: 24 April 2002, 06:39:00 »

Just thinking we also need the Mermish for 'feelings' (states of physical being) as well as "emotions" (states of mentality and spirit).  Partly because this would be a common request from sailors, right....trying to communicate that they need fresh water because they are 'thirsty' or asking where fish are because of hunger!    Partly because merfolk will feel sensations such as the heat of the sun and the chill of icebergs, and may need such expressions in their own tongue

I also suggest that in Mermish grammar, such as it is, we use the personal noun (I, she, the manthing, the whale), then the Mermish word for 'in' (to be inside, surrounded by, covered, submerged), then the emotion or feeling to follow.  

The word "with" to be used for any connection, adverb, or placeholder where "in" does not apply.  Both can also be negative-ized, if you get me.... not-in or not-with.

Sentences transliterated might read  "She~in~hunger " (for "She's in season and wants to mate") or "He~man~thing~with~boat~not-with~fish~"  ("The sailor doesn't have any fish...")   or  "Dolphin~many~in~playful~with~great-fire"  ("The dolphin pod is active and playful this morning...")  Make sense?


Oowii = hungry (wanting food, wanting sex, wanting attention)
Hnn-kii = hungry (from the human tongue, to desire food)
Hss-tii = thirsty (from the human tongue, to require bad-water)
??  = sick  ( not- in- good- body)
?? = well ( good-body)
Hhu-huu  = hot (two short, sharp pants of breath)
Jiiii = cold (long-drawn out shudder of breath through teeth)
Ah-ee = in pain (not technically a word, but rather an imprecation or exclamation, like our 'Ouch!")

 

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"Give me a land of boughs in leaf /  a land of trees that stand; / where trees are fallen there is grief; /  I love no leafless land."   --A.E. Housman
 
Viresse
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« Reply #25 on: 24 April 2002, 19:00:00 »

not in the language mentality right now,  but I can fill in a few of those question-mark words...

huu-iik = sick ( mimicking the sound of vomiting)

haaih = well ( a smile on the face when said, a contented sigh-sound)

Viresse Sheelala

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Viresse
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« Reply #26 on: 29 June 2002, 00:06:00 »

hey? are these on the site yet?

http://www.klintorth.com/images/misc/vir.gif">
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Bard Judith
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« Reply #27 on: 01 July 2002, 02:42:00 »

hey, Viresse found her way back in here!

I was beginning to think I'd have to borrow the pokey stick and shoo her over....

It needs to be collated in readable form, like a table, Vir, and then sent off to Arti-dear.  See the format for one of the other 'lesser languages' - I don't think there is so much that it needs to be alphabetized letter by letter, but can just be printed all in one section under the Merfolk entry as a table - , or a line saying "Click here for a glossary of Basic Mermish" that takes you to another page containing all the words we have above, or something like that.

okies?

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"Give me a land of boughs in leaf /  a land of trees that stand; / where trees are fallen there is grief; /  I love no leafless land."   --A.E. Housman
 
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« Reply #28 on: 02 July 2002, 23:11:00 »

No problem at all. I might be able to do that tomorrow. Coolies...

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Viresse
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« Reply #29 on: 03 July 2002, 23:10:00 »

Okay, I just made a table, I'll send them to Artimidor in just a minute.

http://www.klintorth.com/images/misc/vir.gif">
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