Santharian Development

Santharian World Development => Miscellaneous => Topic started by: Tha'eli on 25 June 2008, 02:26:46



Title: Vaiá Iú Queím [I see you]
Post by: Tha'eli on 25 June 2008, 02:26:46
The nonsense rhyme that is sung at the beginning is meant to be like ring-around-the-rosies, which was actually about the Plague in Europe. I was trying to indicate that when Coór comes down to the world to try and destroy the Dream, everything will turn into chaos - the smoke of burning wizardleaf will no longer be sweet, but bitter. White will become nor'sidian black. Then, at the end, I was saying that it was pointless in trying to hide from him - you might as well hide underneath a baby dor'iyn sheep ;) Enjoy - and yeah, it's supposed to not make much sense, but still have a hidden darkness to it...

Overview
Vaiá Iú Queím is a favourite past-time of elven children, where one player (the 'cór') must catch all the other players. These players must hide while the 'cór' recites a chant, but as soon as the chant is over, all players must freeze where they are and wait to be found. The first player to be found is the new 'cór' in the next round, and the last player to be found is the winner!

Game Name
Vaiá Iú Queím! [I see you!] It originated in the Thaelon Forest, but soon spread through the Zeiphyrian forests and the Auturian woods. Having crossed through human territory, the game was altered slightly to fit their tongue - the 'cór' was renamed the 'core', being the centerpiece to the game (this was also due to a mistranslation), and lost most of its connection to the Shadow. However, it soon died out, as the mothers of human children did not stress the warning chant as much as those of elven heritage. Now, the game is mainly played by members of the Quaelhoirhim and the Aellenrhim residents of the Thaelon Forest, although variations have occurred throughout Santharia in many elven tribes. This game began with the simple chant, sung by mothers to their children, warning them of Coór's evil ways. Eventually, it grew into a form of hide-and-seek, and the true meaning of the words was forgotten. The name of the player who must catch all the others gradually changed to 'cór', much to the relief of many anxious parents who did not want to hear the Shadow's name constantly called out.

Equipment
No equipment is necessary - there must be at least four players for a good game, so that one person can play Coór and the other three can hide. There is no maximum number of players. A good place with lots of hidey-holes is useful.

Game Setup
Before the game can begin, everyone must elect the first player to be the 'cór'. This is done by, after counting to three, all the players shouting 'néh!', indicating that they do not want to be the 'cór'. The player who shouts it last becomes the first 'cór'.
The 'cór' must then shout out the following chant with his eyes closed while the other players hide in locations of their choice.
Do you have the bitter smoke
of a wizard, wizardleaf?
When seek!
Do you see the awful white
that black nor’sidian white?
Upon, dear haven, run amok
When seek!
Look, here he comes!
Hide beneath the gentle fleecy wool
of a dear dor'iyn lamb.
When seek! When seek! When seek!

Rules
All players must run and hide while the 'cór' recites the chant, but as soon as the chant is over, they must freeze where they are, whether they are hidden or not, and must wait until the 'cór' finds them.
When the chant is completed, the 'cór' may open his eyes and attempt to seek out the hidden players. The first player to be caught will become the new 'cór' when the next round begins.
If the 'cór' is caught peeking while chanting the opening poem, the other players are allowed to pinch him twice each, one for each eye. In original games, the 'cór' would then have to find the other players blindfolded, but this practice is no longer seen. The winner is the person found last in each round!
One custom of the game is that the final player is usually given a present, sometimes a necklace made out of shadegrass, although this practice is mostly omitted in present-day games. This small ceremony originated from the understanding of shadegrass' place in an environment; it hides in the dark, yet is vital for survival. In this way, the winner is honoured by placing a small sliver of what Coór could be around their neck.
Another variation (usually found in the Thaelon Forest) is that the other players can continue hiding even after the chant is finished, but are not allowed to leave the boundaries of the game, or they automatically become the new 'cór' in the next round.


Title: Re: iú-vaián-queí [I see you]
Post by: Nsikigan Ho´Tonanese Yourth on 25 June 2008, 03:20:41
Very nice- this is what we like!
It's always good to see a common Terran concept be Santharized, and you have done it well.
 :thumbup:
One notice- you state the winner is usually given a present, and then go on to say this practice is usually committed.
Instead of saying usually given a present, you should note that this is a ceremonial/customary/archaic practice.


Title: Re: iú-vaián-queí [I see you]
Post by: Tha'eli on 25 June 2008, 03:26:03
Thanks, Nsikigan - I'll think of some background to the present-giving and change it around with your suggestions.


Title: Re: iú-vaián-queí [I see you]
Post by: Nsikigan Ho´Tonanese Yourth on 25 June 2008, 03:30:29
No problem!
And I know Nsikigan is a mouth(finger?)full, so goo ahead and just call me Nsiki- makes things easier on non-Eyelian yongues.
Erm, thats pronounced nuh-SEEK-ee. Or ni-SEEK-ee. Your choice.


Title: Re: iú-vaián-queí [I see you]
Post by: Tha'eli on 25 June 2008, 03:32:11
Nsiki, Nsiki, Nsiki... I really like that sound!

Where can I find a page on the current Eyelian stuff? I want to have a look around. It sounds interesting. I LOVE the sound of Nsiki...


Title: Re: iú-vaián-queí [I see you]
Post by: Tha'eli on 25 June 2008, 03:35:29
Ooooh, quick question - are there any plants which are said to protect from evil/have the colours of evil/etc.? I want to connect the practice of giving a woven grass necklace to the winner back to Coor (and is there any way to make those little accent-y things above the vowels so I can write properly? I can make accents going right, but not left...).


Title: Re: iú-vaián-queí [I see you]
Post by: Nsikigan Ho´Tonanese Yourth on 25 June 2008, 03:38:42
Shadegrass perhaps?
And look over at the sidebar- I posted in your other thread about navigation, but it's under the goblin tab, then humans.


Title: Re: iú-vaián-queí [I see you]
Post by: Artimidor Federkiel on 25 June 2008, 03:46:54
Hello and welcome, Thaeli! :wave:

Always good to see a new face and people with ideas. Anyway, I hope your enthusiasm stays for a while, but I see that you've read up a bit on the site and looked through the newbie threads, so this is a good sign as well... - And now for some comments here to help you with your first submission:

- You're missed the Overview part on top of the entry, which is also the most important one. If you read the Overview, you should have all information on the entry in condensed form.

- "iú-vaián-queí" is not proper Styrásh... If you want to delve into languages, you have to be aware of the proper conjugation for example and word order as explained in the Styrásh principles page (http://www.santharia.com/languages/styrash/styrash.htm) ;) - Oh, and why is there an elven name at all for the game?

- Are you allowed to only hide once and stay there once the seeker goes looking? Or can you move around as well later?

- How is the first seeker chosen? I assume with some sort of counting rhyme?

- Game Setup and Rules should ideally be seperated as well, that's why there are two sections defined in the template. You won't have much in that Setup part, but at least determining the first seeker would be in there.

- The nonsense rhyme is a bit non-sensical for me... :lol: Well, at least I have difficulties grabbing the concept. Usually such rhymes follow at least a certain inherent logic. There first two lines sound ok, but then it gets blurry for me.

- Some references to other things on the site never hurt. Here you could e.g. make it a game of a certain Santharian tribe or of a certain region, which then spread. Would be a bit for a possible History section.

At any rate: Good to see you already so eager to get started with an entry - as you can see it always requires some adjustments to get to your goals, but this only makes what we write better :D


Title: Re: iú-vaián-queí [I see you]
Post by: Tha'eli on 25 June 2008, 03:51:34
Wow, a lot to fix xD Good to finally meet you, Artimidor - I've seen you a lot on the other boards and have been looking forward to getting your feedback!
Yes, I can see a lot of things that I can fix with my entry now... I forgot to mention that the game is originally an elven game, so I will include the origin of that... and sorry, I know, I should have properly conjugated it as well xD The dictionary was just too tempting. I needed a quick name so I could submit!
I tried to make the poem as simple as possible while still hinting at Coór's power... sorry if it's not very clear, I explained it as best as I could.

And thanks, Nsiki, for the shadegrass tip - I added that in, as well as some background information about that.

*rubs hands together* Right! Revision time!


Title: Re: iú-vaián-queí [I see you]
Post by: Tharoc Wargrider on 25 June 2008, 03:53:10
Looking good for a first draft, Thaeli. Don't worry about all the comments/suggestions. Like Arti said, it will only help to make your entries better, and it won't be long before you're posting entries that need very little alteration.

Hhhm. I wonder what kinds of games Orc children play........See, you've side-tracked me now. I'm supposed to be re-working the Ashz-oc and dev'ing the White Warg not postulating on Orcen trivialities. PAH!


Title: Re: iú-vaián-queí [I see you]
Post by: Nsikigan Ho´Tonanese Yourth on 25 June 2008, 03:57:09
Well, King of the Hill, and capture the flag, naturally.


Title: Re: iú-vaián-queí [I see you]
Post by: Tharoc Wargrider on 25 June 2008, 03:57:57
I was thinking more like "Pulling the legs off a fly"

Or an Eyelian.


Title: Re: iú-vaián-queí [I see you]
Post by: Tha'eli on 25 June 2008, 04:03:31
A favoured orc-child past-time is collecting the legs of as many creatures as possible. Points vary depending on how many legs of a species has been procured, as well as the diversity and length of the leg in question. If you are not of the orc persuasion, it is wise to ensure that your legs are closely encased in armour before venturing anywhere near orc settlements.

This sounds like fun! :) Hmm... maybe I could develop on this later...?

But for now, I will take all comments to heart and do my best to ensure that you get the most out of this game! (the elf one, not the more interesting orc one)


Title: Re: iú-vaián-queí [I see you]
Post by: Drúadan on 25 June 2008, 04:06:46
*Stands behind Nsiki and looks questioningly at Tharoc* Now a good time for playing?

Hello Thaeli! I just wanted to say that this looks like a very good start and first entry! MUCH better than mine all around. Welcome to the Dream, though I'm sure I missed your Newbie thread. Oh, and don't forget to change your developmental icon to the exclamation mark or the pencil depending on whether or not you want comments. :)

And if you read the shoutbox, I should warn you regardless of what Judy says, if the subject material gets any more difficult than basic multiplication tables I just might be quite as dumb as I look. :D


Title: Re: iú-vaián-queí [I see you]
Post by: Tha'eli on 25 June 2008, 04:09:59
Which means which? I'm assuming the pencil means I want comments...?
*checks*
Argh! Wrong.
Thanks for the tip, I've changed the icon ;)

Haha, and I'm sure you don't look dumb xD


Another question - are there any elven cultures that could use some good ol' traditional games? I can't decide which one this game originated in.


Title: Re: iú-vaián-queí [I see you]
Post by: Nsikigan Ho´Tonanese Yourth on 25 June 2008, 04:22:42
Tharoc, I'm warning you....

Quote
Eyelians are slim for their size, most of them never becoming plump and round in their entire lifetime. But despite their slender form, the Eyelians are very strong. These dark-skinned men have been known to knock their foes back further than most orcs can brag.


Title: Re: iú-vaián-queí [I see you]
Post by: Tha'eli on 25 June 2008, 04:25:13
It is a rare sight indeed for an orc to have a leg belonging to an Eyelian in their collections. Orcs that boast this privilege, more often than not, have been severely wounded in the obtaining of this item. ;)

So, I've updated the game information - added an overview, a few more rules, some more background information, and I've also split the Game Setup from the Rules. I still need a likely elven culture where this game could have originated. Any ideas?


Title: Re: iú-vaián-queí [I see you]
Post by: Drúadan on 25 June 2008, 04:26:30
I could move in for the kill here and call dibs on this fun game for the Tethinrhim tribe, but lemme take a look...

*Reads through carefully*

Okay. With the reference to the Dor’iyn sheep, either southern Sarvonia or northern Aerullin {Sp?} looks best. Deving on Aerullin is off limits at the moment, so lets assume an elf tribe in Santharia for now. If we factor in the wizardleaf reference, we would arrive at a tribe either living in close proximity to mages, very magic-focused themselves, or in a place where wizardleaf commonly grows; i.e. theThaelon Forest. So... that should narrow the selection down a bit. Of course, you might say that more than one tribe uses it, for example, that it has spread through the two major elven woods in Manthria,  Zeiphyrian Forests and the Auturian woods. Which, incidently, leads to the Tethinrhim and the Quaelhoirhim. Now look how slyly I did that. ;)


Of course you could pick any other tribe you wanted, but that's some basic logical things you might consider. Almost any tribe out there could use a game, as no tribe is yet "fully" developed, with all cultural things done.

Sorry for not explaining the icon thing. Glad you figured it out. :)

Hehe Nsiki...

EDIT: just noticed something, what is "shadegrass"? It has no entry, did I miss something? Are you going to develop it?



Title: Re: qué vaiá-á iú [I see you]
Post by: Tha'eli on 25 June 2008, 04:29:28
Oh, you sly one.
However, since Quaelhoirhim sounds really beautiful, I'll choose that ;) Sorry.


Title: Re: qué vaiá-á iú [I see you]
Post by: Drúadan on 25 June 2008, 04:32:20
 :rolling:

No hard feelings, I'll let you live... this time.


Title: Re: qué vaiá-á iú [I see you]
Post by: Tha'eli on 25 June 2008, 04:36:53
New updates - have fixed the name to proper conjugation etc, with help from Art, and am beginning work on elven origins. Thanks, Drúadan, for all that info!


Title: Re: qué vaiá-á iú [I see you]
Post by: Nsikigan Ho´Tonanese Yourth on 25 June 2008, 04:40:20
Shade grass does too exist...
2nd to last entry under grasses in the herbarium.
I try to stay away from there as best I can ;)


Title: Re: qué vai-á iú [I see you]
Post by: Tha'eli on 25 June 2008, 04:43:52
Okay, I think I've finished it now... I pretty much copied your help word for word, Drúadan, sorry about that, but it was really helpful, thanks.

Can someone give it a final proofread before I officially submit it as my first entry? 8D


Title: Re: qué vai-á iú [I see you]
Post by: Nsikigan Ho´Tonanese Yourth on 25 June 2008, 04:47:52
It'll work more like this- just type as best you can, and put up the ! symbol. Then integrate comments with the pencil icon up, put the ! back up, and repeat as needed. Eventually you'll get to the point where you don't have to do many revisions at all. But you're work is never really submitted, more posted, revised, and accepted.


Title: Re: qué vai-á iú [I see you]
Post by: Tha'eli on 25 June 2008, 04:49:58
Aahh, I see. Okay, then the ! is up ;) Comments, please!


Title: Re: qué vai-á iú [I see you]
Post by: Nsikigan Ho´Tonanese Yourth on 25 June 2008, 04:53:04
Very nice!
i would like to see the thiong about shadegrass removed from paranthesis, and integrated better. As it stands, it's a bit removed, and my eye just skips over it.


Title: Re: qué vai-á iú [I see you]
Post by: Tha'eli on 25 June 2008, 04:54:46
Okay, I added it as a separate detail in the Rules section, thanks for the tip, Nsiki ;)


Title: Re: qué vai-á iú [I see you]
Post by: Drúadan on 25 June 2008, 05:11:17
Lets take a closer look:

Overview
A favourite past-time of elven children, where one player (the 'cór') must catch all the other players. Not a complete sentence, needs subject! These players must hide while the 'cór' recites a chant, but as soon as the chant is over, all players must freeze where they are and wait to be found. The first player to be found is the new 'cór' in the next round, and the last player to be found is the winner!

Game Name
Qué vai-á iú! [I see you!] originated in the Thaelon Forest, but soon spread south through the Zeiphyrian forests and the Auturian woods. as one can tell by the references to dor'iyn sheep and wizardleaf.  The explanation of the references is not necessary. Now, the game is mainly played by members of the Quaelhoirhim, although variations have occurred throughout Santharia.  Sorry to say this is a little more complex than that. If the game spread south, these variations would have inevitably spread through human territory. Take a look at this map (http://santharia.com/maps/medium/santharia_provinces.htm) and look at the northern Vardynn province. The Thaelon is located there. Now scroll down to Manthria and southern Sanguia. That’s where the Auturian and Zeiphyrian forests are. As you can see, there are multiple elven forests; including the Goltherlon {sp?} and the Almatrar in between. Assume that you can discount some of the smaller woods as well as the Shivering woods for various reasons. Now, you have to explain why the game was not adopted and kept by the elves of the Thaelon forests. Why was so readily accepted by the Qualhoirhim and not other tribes. Plus, what do the human tribes living in close proximity to the elves, for example the Avennorians, do differently. Do they have a different name? Surely they don’t play with elvish words like “cor”. This game has spread through a fairly large portion of the continent. IMHO it’s not enough to just say, “it spread”.  This game began with the simple chant, sung by mothers to their children, warning them of Coór's evil ways. Eventually, it grew into a form of hide-and-seek, and the true meaning of the words was forgotten. The name of the player who must catch all the others gradually changed to 'cór', much to the relief of many anxious parents who did not want to hear the Shadow's name constantly called out.

Equipment
No equipment is necessary - there must be at least four players for a good game, so that one person can play Coór and the other three can hide. There is no maximum number of players. A good place with lots of hidey-holes is useful.

Game Setup
Before the game can begin, everyone must elect the first player to be the 'cór'. This is done by, after counting to three, all the players shouting '!' The player who shouts it last becomes the first 'cór'.  Nice exclamation point. :P What do they shout? Guess you must have forgotten to add
The 'cór' must then shout out the following chant with his eyes closed while the other players hide in locations of their choice.
Do you have the bitter smoke
of a wizard, wizardleaf?
When seek!
Do you see the awful white
that black nor’sidian white?
Upon, dear haven, run amok
When seek!
Look, here he comes!
Hide beneath the gentle fleecy wool
of a dear dor'iyn lamb.
When seek! When seek! When seek!
 I kind’ve like this. Looks different and good. :)

Rules
All players must run and hide while the 'cór' recites the chant, but as soon as the chant is over, they must freeze where they are, whether they are hidden or not, and must wait until the 'cór' finds them.
When the chant is completed, the 'cór' may open his eyes and attempt to seek out the hidden players. The first player to be caught will become the new 'cór' when the next round begins (one custom of the game is that the final player is usually given a present, sometimes a necklace made out of shade grass, although this practice is mostly omitted in present-day games. This small ceremony originated from the understanding of shade grass' place in an environment; it hides in the dark, yet is vital for survival. In this way, the winner is honoured by placing a small sliver of what Coór could be around their neck).  This comparison is complex and well done. Great job!
If the 'cór' is caught peeking while chanting the opening poem, the other players are allowed to pinch him twice each, one for each eye. In original games, the 'cór' would then have to find the other players blindfolded, but this practice is no longer seen. The other players are not allowed to leave the boundaries of the game, or they automatically become the new 'cór' in the next round. The winner is the person found last in each round!  You have two rule variations in there. Perhaps this gives you a chance to distinguish between the various tribes?

Not bad :) Your writing is fluid and reads nicely. In the name section, I hope I didn’t go too overboard with my suggestions. In my earlier comment regarding the tribe a few posts back I was only making a suggestion, not saying that having the game migrate that distance is a good idea. Perhaps it would be simpler, from a first-entry point of view, to simply have the game originate in the Zeiphyrian forest? That saves you the trouble of having to explain an endless history.


Title: Re: qué vai-á iú [I see you]
Post by: Tha'eli on 25 June 2008, 05:15:21
Aaah, but an endless history gives it  more realisticness ;) I have a plan for how it spread into human territory, don't you worry. And yeah, I should probably add what they shout xD Completely forgot about that!

Thanks for the suggestions, I'll definitely fix those things.


Title: Re: qué vai-á iú [I see you]
Post by: Drúadan on 25 June 2008, 05:17:03
A plan? Oh my. And by the way... endless history only adds realism as long as it is realistic. Hehe...  :D


Title: Re: qué vai-á iú [I see you]
Post by: Tha'eli on 25 June 2008, 05:22:58
True, true ;)

I added the changes - could you tell me what you think?


Title: Re: qué vai-á iú [I see you]
Post by: Drúadan on 25 June 2008, 05:31:08
Look alright now to me, though an important point i forgot to mention. Please color your changes in the future, so that it is easier for people, at a glance, to see what you've changed.  :)

Nice first entry! Now let's just see what the expert experts think. I think Arti is taking a look right now...


Title: Re: qué vai-á iú [I see you]
Post by: Tha'eli on 25 June 2008, 05:32:09
Okay, I'll do that in the future, thanks :)

Oooh! *crosses fingers* Hope he thinks it's good :D


Title: Re: qué vai-á iú [I see you]
Post by: Falethas Whisperwind on 25 June 2008, 05:50:53
Just popping in with a little item: if you want to properly say "I see you" in the elvish language, it'd be vaiá iú queím, where qué "you" takes the accusative case because it functions as the direct object of the verb vaián, "to see."

But that's just unimportant linguistic rambling, haha  :buck: So just know that if elves did actually play this game, they'd call it Vaiá Iú Queím.  :)


Title: Re: qué vai-á iú [I see you]
Post by: Tha'eli on 25 June 2008, 05:53:56
Ahh, thanks, Quaélh'Orín ;) Wow, that's quite a mouthful - mind if I call you Quaélh? Looks like 'quail'... I love those birds.


Title: Re: qué vai-á iú [I see you]
Post by: Falethas Whisperwind on 25 June 2008, 05:55:18
Haha yes, Quaélh is perfectly fine. Although pronounced a little differently than "quail," I might add  :lol:


Title: Re: qué vai-á iú [I see you]
Post by: Tha'eli on 25 June 2008, 05:56:46
I know, but it'll be easier for me to remember it that way ;)


Title: Re: Vaiá Iú Queím [I see you]
Post by: Tha'eli on 25 June 2008, 19:08:37
Is it ready to be 'blarrowed'? ;)


Title: Re: Vaiá Iú Queím [I see you]
Post by: Mannix on 25 June 2008, 19:28:45
I just have a question about its origin.  Thaelon is said to be the home of Light Elves, but these are mythical.  However, a few Aellenrhim do also live there to take care of the forest.  I guess they could be the creators, but I don't know it just doesn't seem like a thing to come out of Thaelon.  I guess thats my opinion so you don't have to change it.  If it were to come from Thaelon, wouldn't it spread to Bolder, the main home of the Aellenrhim.  Also, how were the meaning of the words forgotten, aren't they in Styrash, at least thats what the Aellenrhim speak.  I'm also wondering why Coór changed to cór.

Mannix


Title: Re: Vaiá Iú Queím [I see you]
Post by: Tha'eli on 25 June 2008, 20:48:18
Aahhhhhh! *cringes*

Okay, I don't know much about Thaelon etc... I've just kind of brought it what people have suggested.

The meaning of the words were just naturally forgotten... I didn't know ring-around-the-rosies was about the plague until I was twelve, or something. And Coór changed to cór, partly because the parents didn't like the idea of their children acting as the Shadow, and partly because they have similar meanings - Coór is the god of evil, and cór means dark/night.

But is the Thaelon/Light Elf thing really obvious? Should I change it?


Title: Re: Vaiá Iú Queím [I see you]
Post by: Mannix on 25 June 2008, 20:59:06
I'd at least change where you say inhabitants of Thaelon to Aellenrhim of Thaelon, we don't want people thinking the Lightelves are real.  By they way, who told you to include Thaelon.  I'm not saying you shouldn't use it, just wondering.  I like the bit about mothers getting upset by it, especiall in such a sacred place.  OH and by the way, you probably don't know much about Thaelon because there's not much to know, well at least no ton site.  Me and Arti are revising it, but it is going to take a while.  Personally I wouldn't change it from Thaelon, just tweak it a bit.  I think it could fit nicely.  I'll read through later.

Mannix


Title: Re: Vaiá Iú Queím [I see you]
Post by: Tha'eli on 25 June 2008, 21:08:23
Okay, I added the appropriate change.

Drúadan suggested the Thaelon Forest:
Quote
Okay. With the reference to the Dor’iyn sheep, either southern Sarvonia or northern Aerullin {Sp?} looks best. Deving on Aerullin is off limits at the moment, so lets assume an elf tribe in Santharia for now. If we factor in the wizardleaf reference, we would arrive at a tribe either living in close proximity to mages, very magic-focused themselves, or in a place where wizardleaf commonly grows; i.e. theThaelon Forest. So... that should narrow the selection down a bit. Of course, you might say that more than one tribe uses it, for example, that it has spread through the two major elven woods in Manthria,  Zeiphyrian Forests and the Auturian woods. Which, incidently, leads to the Tethinrhim and the Quaelhoirhim.



Title: Re: Vaiá Iú Queím [I see you]
Post by: Mannix on 25 June 2008, 21:11:53
Yep, I've read through and may I say well done.  It's a very nice entry, I can tell you did your homework.  I can't think of any tweaking as my brain is tired, need sleep.  But, after reading it, I don't think it needs it.  Just one thing.
In original games, the 'cór' would then have to find the other players blindfolded, but this practice is no longer seen.(space)The winner is the person found last in each round!
Well Done!

Mannix


Title: Re: Vaiá Iú Queím [I see you]
Post by: Tha'eli on 25 June 2008, 21:14:05
Thank you! I'll fix those things right away :D


Title: Re: Vaiá Iú Queím [I see you]
Post by: Artimidor Federkiel on 28 June 2008, 03:11:23
Ok, let's have a look again:

- Concerning the Styrásh: We've never actually defined that there are declinations for words like "you", but ok, makes more sense that way. If we want to have word order correct as well and follow the example given in the Styrásh principles entry, then we read "Pharanté es sá móchcin'lón énh styrín" (translated: "The elves travel into the dark forest"), which would mean in this respect: Vaiá queím iú.  :cool:

- Overview: You mention the "cór", yet someone who just reads the entry and doesn't have a background doesn't actually know what "cór" means in Styrásh or what it could stand for. Explain this a bit.

- The first line in the Game Name section should be:
Quote
The name "Vaiá Queím Ií" (Sty´rásh for "I see you!"] originated...

- It has already been mentioned that the Thaelon as such isn't the best source for a game like this, simply because this is a sacred forest, and there exist only Aellenrhim caretakers there (see the current entry (http://www.santharia.com/dev/index.php/topic,12440.msg147982.html#msg147982) in progress). See especially the Aelle'lón section there. You might use the Bolder as the source of this game, which is where the Aellenrhim came from. Quaelhoirhim don't live in the Thaelon at all.

- You also mention that one player is "Coór", and then you use the term "cór". I guess this could be confusing to readers. These two words have different means as well!

- The chant is still rather absurd, but hey, with a chaotic God in play, this might as well just fit :)

That's it basically from my side :)


Title: Re: Vaiá Iú Queím [I see you]
Post by: Falethas Whisperwind on 29 June 2008, 07:42:17
Concerning the Styrásh: We've never actually defined that there are declinations for words like "you", but ok, makes more sense that way. If we want to have word order correct as well and follow the example given in the Styrásh principles entry, then we read "Pharanté es sá móchcin'lón énh styrín" (translated: "The elves travel into the dark forest"), which would mean in this respect: Vaiá queím iú.

Ah, I see. That clarifies a lot. I had always assumed that the was a necessary part of the conjugated verb, not just a subject pronoun. Does that mean, then, that the present-tense first and second person singular conjugations of Styrásh verbs take the same form, i.e. vaiá "I see," vaiá "you see," vaiát "he/she/it sees," etc.?


Title: Re: Vaiá Iú Queím [I see you]
Post by: Artimidor Federkiel on 29 June 2008, 14:49:44
That the first and the second person both are "vaiá" (as it is on the Styrásh Principles page) is definitely a mistake. Don't know how it got there, maybe when the Styrásh spelling was added, but the second person should definitely be "vaiás". Otherwise there would be no way to distinguish these forms.

I'll fix that on the site.


Title: Re: Vaiá Iú Queím [I see you]
Post by: Falethas Whisperwind on 30 June 2008, 04:08:54
That clears up SO much, haha  :nod: Thank ye, master sage.

Might I suggest, then, that we remove the subject pronouns entirely, or else create for them a separate chart when we get around to that language revamp? Having them there implies that they are a necessary part of the conjugation, but as the person and number are indicated by affixion, there's really no need to list them in that chart as well.

Squee  :grin:

ANYWAYS. Getting back to the entry then, with all of this taken into account, then yes, I concur that "I See You" would translate as "Vaiá Queím Iú." Or, if you wanted to be even more concise, you could eliminate the superfluous subject pronoun entirely and simply say, "Vaiá Queím."


Title: Re: Vaiá Iú Queím [I see you]
Post by: Artimidor Federkiel on 02 July 2008, 05:21:03
Well, I don't see the "iú" etc. as superfluous in this list, as it usually is always included. I suggest to provide the translation below however so that people see the Styrásh text actually means. If we don't have it here you'd have a hard time looking for those personal pronouns.

P.S. Seems Tha'eli has disappeared somewhere in the underground with that moving stuff that she mentioned... Let's see when she'll popu up again...


Title: Re: Vaiá Iú Queím [I see you]
Post by: Nsikigan Ho´Tonanese Yourth on 19 August 2008, 13:48:51
Amen Art - I need some Eyelian company!


Title: Re: Vaiá Iú Queím [I see you]
Post by: Drúadan on 24 August 2008, 07:03:03
As you've dragged this up Nsiki... ;)

Anyone know where Thaeli went? She set a record and what, disapeared? Shame that... At the rate she worked we'd have 20 entries from her per update. :P


Title: Re: Vaiá Iú Queím [I see you]
Post by: Nsikigan Ho´Tonanese Yourth on 24 August 2008, 08:37:11
I didnt drag this up.... Art did ;)
And here's why shes gone....

As you've dragged this up Nsiki... ;)

Anyone know where Thaeli went? She set a record and what, disapeared? Shame that... At the rate she worked we'd have 20 entries from her per update. :P


Title: Re: Vaiá Iú Queím [I see you]
Post by: Artimidor Federkiel on 26 February 2009, 05:37:12
Entry set to the "Question" status - ready for takeaway!


Title: Re: Vaiá Iú Queím [I see you]
Post by: Nsikigan Ho´Tonanese Yourth on 26 February 2009, 06:48:03
I'll pick this up Art, as I sort of adopted this jsal ;)
Should I also do the beads entry?


Title: Re: Vaiá Iú Queím [I see you]
Post by: Artimidor Federkiel on 26 February 2009, 07:04:28
Just one after the other, Nsiki :) Make sure to take care of the major problems that have been pointed out in the Rimmerins context, your masterwork thingy, that should be the most important thing to do. If that's all settled, I'd be happy if you can pick up here and work on any related stuff :D


Title: Re: Vaiá Iú Queím [I see you]
Post by: Nsikigan Ho´Tonanese Yourth on 26 February 2009, 07:08:52
i think it is, for the most part. There's just one more issue I need to take care of, methinks, and I've just solved it...
I am feeling a bit drained however :P
Maybe I'll just go on a developing spree to jumpstart my batteries as it were ;)
Thanks, Art


Title: Re: Vaiá Iú Queím [I see you]
Post by: Nsikigan Ho´Tonanese Yourth on 26 February 2009, 07:22:15
Problematic bits, thinks to be changed/added in are in green. I mean yellow. Whatever.
Overview
Vaiá Iú Queím is a favourite past-time of elven children, where one player (the 'cór') must catch all the other players. These players must hide while the 'cór' recites a chant, but as soon as the chant is over, all players must freeze where they are and wait to be found. The first player to be found is the new 'cór' in the next round, and the last player to be found is the winner!

Game Name
Vaiá Iú Queím! [I see you!] It originated in the Thaelon Forest, but soon spread through the Zeiphyrian forests and the Auturian woods. Having crossed through human territory, the game was altered slightly to fit their tongue - the 'cór' was renamed the 'core', being the centerpiece to the game (this was also due to a mistranslation), and lost most of its connection to the Shadow. However, it soon died out, as the mothers of human children did not stress the warning chant as much as those of elven heritage. Now, the game is mainly played by members of the Quaelhoirhim and the Aellenrhim residents of the Thaelon Forest, although variations have occurred throughout Santharia in many elven tribes. This game began with the simple chant, sung by mothers to their children, warning them of Coór's evil ways. Eventually, it grew into a form of hide-and-seek, and the true meaning of the words was forgotten. The name of the player who must catch all the others gradually changed to 'cór', much to the relief of many anxious parents who did not want to hear the Shadow's name constantly called out.

Equipment
No equipment is necessary - there must be at least four players for a good game, so that one person can play Coór and the other three can hide. There is no maximum number of players. A good place with lots of hidey-holes is useful. however, sometimes only 2 kiddies play, yadda, yadda, yadda

Game Setup
Before the game can begin, everyone must elect the first player to be the 'cór'. This is done by, after counting to three, all the players shouting 'néh!', indicating that they do not want to be the 'cór'. The player who shouts it last becomes the first 'cór'. Haha, its "nose-goes"!
The 'cór' must then shout out the following chant with his eyes closed while the other players hide in locations of their choice.
Do you have the bitter smoke
of a wizard, wizardleaf?
When seek!
Do you see the awful white
that black nor’sidian white?
Upon, dear haven, run amok
When seek!
Look, here he comes!
Hide beneath the gentle fleecy wool
of a dear dor'iyn lamb.
When seek! When seek! When seek!
However, some children can't quite master this so....
Variations exist....

Rules
All players must run and hide while the 'cór' recites the chant, but as soon as the chant is over, they must freeze where they are, whether they are hidden or not, and must wait until the 'cór' finds them.
When the chant is completed, the 'cór' may open his eyes and attempt to seek out the hidden players. The first player to be caught will become the new 'cór' when the next round begins.
If the 'cór' is caught peeking while chanting the opening poem, the other players are allowed to pinch him twice each, one for each eye. In original games, the 'cór' would then have to find the other players blindfolded, but this practice is no longer seen. The winner is the person found last in each round!
One custom of the game is that the final player is usually given a present, sometimes a necklace made out of shadegrass, although this practice is mostly omitted in present-day games. This small ceremony originated from the understanding of shadegrass' place in an environment; it hides in the dark, yet is vital for survival. In this way, the winner is honored by placing a small sliver of what Coór could be around their neck.
Another variation (usually found in the Thaelon Forest) is that the other players can continue hiding even after the chant is finished, but are not allowed to leave the boundaries of the game, or they automatically become the new 'cór' in the next round.


Title: Re: Vaiá Iú Queím [I see you]
Post by: Irid alMenie on 26 February 2009, 16:02:02
Nsiki, this is probably just me, but most of what you coloured red is exactly the same as in the first post... Also, you changed 'honoured' to 'honored'... we're still using British spelling last time I checked ;)


Title: Re: Vaiá Iú Queím [I see you]
Post by: Nsikigan Ho´Tonanese Yourth on 27 February 2009, 05:49:30
Oh, no, I haven't made any changes yet - those are just places I'm planning to change :p sorry!


Title: Re: Vaiá Iú Queím [I see you]
Post by: Valan Nonesuch on 02 June 2010, 12:23:28
Since Nsikigan back I'll bump this back up!
You've got work to be doing lad! :grin:


Title: Re: Vaiá Iú Queím [I see you]
Post by: Nsikigan Ho´Tonanese Yourth on 02 June 2010, 13:46:20
Well spotted Val! Thanks for reminding me of my obligations :)


Title: Re: Vaiá Iú Queím [I see you]
Post by: Valan Nonesuch on 02 June 2010, 13:48:11
I've been wondering about this one for ages. :D


Title: Re: Vaiá Iú Queím [I see you]
Post by: Artimidor Federkiel on 03 June 2010, 03:39:43
Ah yes, you wanted to conclude this, N'siki right? Well, maybe it's the right time now until that camel-like idea is approved etc. - Most of this entry is pretty much done anyway and you've raised some good points methinks, so let's hope we'll see that one get done!