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Helvíl Ypherén
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« on: 25 April 2007, 01:00:29 »

1. If a mage decided to learn fire magic would that affect the dominant car'all within his car'all. I mean practicing fire magic would cause the fire car'all of the mage to become dominant? 

2. Is this the reason why a mage cant learn a new element or having trouble to learn a new element?

3. Learning an element would cause the mage to change in terms of attitude??? Like a fire mage will have a short temper because of the fire car'all, a water mage can become unpredictable because of the dominance in the water car'all, a wind mage can become more stealthy because of the element of the wind, and an earth mage would become stubborn because of the earth car'all being dominant?
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« Reply #1 on: 25 April 2007, 01:35:19 »

1. I doubt so, at least probably not to too great an extent.  And the proper term would be Fire ounia; car'all refers to the whole thing.  Magic deals with manipulation of car'all, which doesn't change the caster's car'all much unless it's the one being manipulated. 

2. The explanation we currently have is that one has to understand an element well in order to be any good at magic of that element, so learning more than one will interfere with that and make one at best a very poor mage. 

3. Again, I doubt so.  Personality does probably influence a person's choice of elements though.  Fire magic for example, is pretty aggressive and good for combat, so people with such an inclination will probably be more likely to pick it. 
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Marvin Cerambit
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« Reply #2 on: 25 April 2007, 01:46:13 »

2. Additionally (IMHO) it could be something that's looked down upon in Ximax which would be another reason why none would do it.
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Mina
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« Reply #3 on: 25 April 2007, 02:03:26 »

In Ximax, I'd guess that it's not allowed.  Elsewhere, it's probably considered a waste of time at least. 
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Helvíl Ypherén
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« Reply #4 on: 25 April 2007, 20:35:09 »

So you mean the only reason why mages cant learn another element is because of conflicting doctrines. However for long living race like the elves could learn the two after mastering one since they have a very long life spans......
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« Reply #5 on: 25 April 2007, 20:42:31 »

Well, elves tend to learn things more slowly and more in-depth than humans do, so that's not too likely either. 
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Drasil Razorfang
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« Reply #6 on: 26 April 2007, 06:28:51 »

@ Mina: Right answer wrong reason IMHO.  While elves do learn slower so would be subject to the same limitations as a human mage, its not because they study more indepth.  Elves learn differently, not more.  Your wording is definatly misleading.

Also, this brings up the question of Elven gifted ones being able to learn to elements.  As you said in one of the CD-mod forum threads, when you were talking about my magic incompetance and how I shouldn't be allowed to make a mage character and such, Gifted Ones learn magic faster than regular students because it comes naturally to them.  Thus, would an elf of this status, who already had quite a long life, be able to squeeze in both elements and be able to manipulate both with a standard degree of competance?
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Helvíl Ypherén
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« Reply #7 on: 26 April 2007, 21:03:57 »

So a mage can actually learn two or more elements if he chooses to? Because there isn't any particular reason to stop a mage from learning more than one elements. And the given reason is that learning two elemental magic is a waste of time for everyone is like speaking in general... I mean what if a fire mage decided to quit his studies of fire magic to go for earth magic instead, then he has learned two elements (but he has not mastered the fire yet but he has learned it), right?   
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« Reply #8 on: 26 April 2007, 22:18:08 »

@Drasil: I never said that one was the reason for the other.  Elves do learn slower, and they do learn more in-depth.  That might be one of the reason for them learning more slowly, but probably not the only reason.  It falls under 'learning differently' anyway. 

Despite their longer life, their slower rate of learning would also make it hard for them to learn multiple elements well.  However, learning Xeua or Ecua magic is in a sense not that different from learning to use multiple elements competently.  This is why in Ximax these two schools are restricted to those who have pretty much mastered their element - they should have a very good understanding of magical techniques by then, and would have an easier time learning how these techniques can be applied to other elements as well.  It is not likely for lower level magi to understand such things.  So anyway, someone who's mastered one element and is interested in the others is most likely going to start studying Xeua instead of trying to over in another elemental school.  The way they understand magic should have shifted sufficiently to make it pretty much impossible to do that anyway. 

In Elven schools, it is possible that, since Elves do things differently, they allow one to learn Xeua (or Ecua, depending on the tribe) magic right away, without having to learn elemental magic first.  That might be why they tend to have a larger proportion of Xeua and Ecua magi.  However, it will probably take very long (even in Elven terms) before such a mage can achieve anything useful.  Definitely not something for the impatient. 

The Gifted don't necessarily learn faster.  They have certain advantages, but they'd also have to have the interest in order to really excel.  Otherwise, they're not going to achieve much regardless of how much talent they have. 

@Shansi: That is, as mentioned, a waste of time for everyone involved.  At lower levels, the two forms of magic would seem sufficiently different that it would be extremely hard to switch from one to the other.  Ximax might forbid it for that reason.  It is only in the higher levels that the underlying similarities start to become apparent to those who are more inclined towards the theoretical side of magic. 
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Marvin Cerambit
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« Reply #9 on: 27 April 2007, 01:15:24 »

Even gifted people (as in great with magic, not necessarily those that could do some uncontrolled magic without learning anything) would waste time learning more then a single element. It's the difference between becoming good at one element or just so-so at two.

Edit: I didn't necessarily think of forbidding it, but rather looking down on those that choose to waste their time.
« Last Edit: 27 April 2007, 01:17:22 by Marvin Cerambit » Logged
Helvíl Ypherén
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« Reply #10 on: 27 April 2007, 21:36:40 »

Well ximaxian mages are not the only one who could teach magic but also those who have learned it and chooses to teach it to other people to pass on their knowledge so it doesn't really mean that one could be prohibited by the laws or the rules of  ximax because theres alot of other teachers out there that might even surpass the teaching of ximax... So a mage isnt prohibited by the laws of the school or laws of the kingdoms but their bodies or mind that prohibits them from learning much more because of conflicting doctrines in each elements...   
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Miraran Tehuriden
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« Reply #11 on: 27 April 2007, 21:39:33 »

Not in Santharia, where nearly all scolarly magic has bonds with the Academy. One you move away from their territory, options might be more open.
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Avrah Kehabhra

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« Reply #12 on: 27 April 2007, 21:56:57 »

Indeed.  In Santharia, virtually all scholarly magic is Ximaxian or Elven, which is almost the same.  Also, pretty much all the best magi who weren't from one of the Elven schools studied at and work for Ximax.  There might be other exceptional magi out there, but they most likely don't use the same magic system. 
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