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Author Topic: The Kyranian Men (Masterwork)  (Read 16417 times)
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Garret Arroway
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« Reply #15 on: 06 August 2008, 06:20:10 »

Yeah I figured that out after having to re-code the history section two or three times. Didn't and don't really expect someone to get through 37 pages swiftly. Just glad to get the writing part finished and look forward to getting some edits done once I recover from the last five or so days of little sleep. Thanks for taking your time to look over it when ya get the chance. :)
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« Reply #16 on: 06 August 2008, 11:51:08 »

*Clears a few weeks off the schedule to do a uri on Garret's masterwork*

Coren would be proud.  thumbup
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« Reply #17 on: 06 August 2008, 14:41:11 »

Wait till you actually read it.  Bloomin' amazing.  A real masterwork, with loving detail in every paragraph, and some images that will define how to do a tribe entry in future.   I salute you, Garret - an achievement to be proud of.

There are quite a few minor errata which will require a careful uri-check, but nothing major.  I'll try to comment as well on some factual data that you may wish to consider (filling a whole castle moat with oil would not only be incredibly expensive and wasteful, but wellnigh impossible - how many cubic peds would that work out to?  What you do is flood the moat with water and if you NEED to set it on fire, pour a BIT of oil on top and ignite it when your enemies are actually trying to cross the moat.)  - a few small things like that. 

In general, though, I'm amazed by the level of effort put so consistently forth over the vast mass of this entry. 

I'm also looking forward to seeing some of the spinoff entries developed, in particular the Forest Cotton (which should be Forest Toccon btw) and the Longhorns.  I had wanted a Highland Cattle -type beast for ages!

Bravo again!
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« Reply #18 on: 06 August 2008, 17:11:56 »

Ok, I can at least just start with an Uri, Garret, even if it might take its time... Well, if you say masterwork, then you mean masterwork, eh? lol But I can give you at least a bit to chew on by looking through some passages for a start:

Uri-Check Legend:
Yellow...stands for errata like grammar, spelling, and other 'minor' changes such as transposing two words
Orange...is used for editor's text, which is not directly part of the entry: comments, questions, disagreements, clarification requests
Grey...marks unclear passages like sentences that don't make sense or definitely need to be rephrased by the writer himself/herself

The Kyranians.
Question: Do we have something like a secondary name for them, like "Proudmen" for the Erpheronians, or "Tamers" for the Eyelian? "Men of Cyroan" would also be already an explanation for the name. Something that befits their way of life would be cool in general.

Overview.
The Kyranians represent a human tribe founded by Cyroan Thromgolin, an infantry lieutnant under the command of Dietych during the fall of the legendary elven kingdom Fá'áv'cál'âr, where all races were united at the beginning of time. (We usually write full sentences, this was still a remnant of the old entry that should now be fixed.) Cyroan led his people to the Lower Fores in Southern Sarvonia, and settled near the Steppe of Kruswik, the Ilian Plateau and the Plains of Truoor, forming the Kyranian Kingdom.

These simple (well mostly) people stayed almost unchanged over the years, living in the moment and dealing with things as they came. Rustic people to the core, they lived off the land, hunting for what game they needed, they domesticated and raised cattle, horses, and other beasts on the Steppe, the renowned warg being one of them for a time. They flourished for several millenia after having overcome the effects of the ferocious War of the Chosen, but after the eventual fall of the Kyranian Kingdom in 806 b.S. the Centoraurians moved in their territory claiming bit by bit Kyranian land as their own. After the foundation and expansion of Tharania in 482 b.S. the Kyranians ceased to be in name though some of their ways still hold to this day. (I suggest to omit the date here at the end, because Santharian time progresses like here on Earth, so if you don't mention the date it's still accurate.)

A note on nomenclature: I see you also cover that further down. However, the thing you should keep in mind here as well is that the Kyranian key names that you use should be able to construct out of the syllables you put down in the Nomenclature section. Either that, or - now that we do a very thorough revision - you could substitute old names altogether with names based on your new rules if existing names don't fit into the scheme. Things like that can hardly be avoided, because once the entry was made no thoughts went into their nomenclature.

Anyway, check those names like "Cyroan" or "Dietych" and see what you can do with them in this regard. If you substitute a name entirely, make sure to let me know the old and the new name, I'll make sure that the references on the whole site are changed. If these names appear primarily in history tables, I can handle that rather easily with the program I coded to put up the history tables.

Also: I touch that further down as well, but need to put that in here - are Kyranians extinct? You pretty much give that impression, yet they surely represent a still existing tribe in the Santharian conglommeration of tribes, even though their pure numbers might be reduced by now. I'd always have a eye on that and mention that they still have their role in Santharian society of today, even though it's only a minor one.


Appearance.
Some general notes are required here: You write the whole section in past tense, as if Kyranians as such don't exist anymore or at least you make no reference to the Santharian kingdom, of which they are currently part of. In current tribe entries we try to at least cover that a bit, and writing in past tense isn't ideal here, because Kyranians still exist and the core of the tribe might still follow the old traditions, like e.g. the Eyelians. A lot might have mixed with other tribes, but the archetypical Kyranian is still around.

So I would perhaps recommend a short introduction with reference to their current integration in the Santharian kingdom and basically use the present tense. Further down when their are clear references to ancient Kyrania I'd point that out that this and that was the case back then, and that it now can be observed in diminished form or something. - Get the idea?


Kyranians tended to be of average height and sometimes a bit taller. Most were between a ped and two fores and two peds in height with the tallest being a half a palmspan over two peds. The women of this tribe were about the same height as the men, though they rarely reached two peds. Smaller and medium sized frames were most commonly seen as the Kyranians tended more toward the lithe and swift builds with muscles to fit their life style. Broader frames were uncommon but not unseen. Those that showed signs of being larger than normal were highly prized by smiths and the military. More than one verbal battle has been waged over a promising youth throughout the years.

Around twelve and thirteen years of age, the young Kyranians' features began to show the man they would grow to be. Those that were already showing signs of wider shoulders and strength were conscripted into the King’s Service, unless they had been taken as an apprentice by a craftsman. After a year of service to their master, they would be evaluated and if they showed an aptitude for their craft they would be allowed to stay. Others were taken from their masters and forced into the King’s Service.

The hair and eye colour (We use more ancient spelling!) of these people usually leaned toward the darker shades. Various shades of brown hair were the most prominent with black running a close second. Red was most commonly seen in the Thromgolin, though outside of the bloodlines it was rather rare and blond was nonexistent. Their eyes were mostly dark shades of brown, green and grey, with the occasional black and/or purple thrown in the mix. Like blond hair, blue eyes were not seen in full blooded Kyranians and the darker colourings of these people overrode the lighter colourings in mixed blood children of the time. Thromgolins, considered the royal line, were known for their fiery red hair and bright, emerald green eyes. During the height of the Thromgolin families reign, many children that had red hair and green eyes were rumored to be bastards of the ruling family since that colouring was rather rare among the common folk. (Note that Erpheronians are also primarily red haired, so maybe give that key hair colour/shape a bit of a twist to avoid confusion? For example Judy gave the Caltharians a unique 'striped' or 'streaked' effect for a change - still the entry is a work in progress -, so maybe the Kyranians have something unique as well, like differences in the hair line, e.g. grey mingling much earlier with the hair than at other tribes or that their hair colour was lighter than the Erpheronian one, something in that direction. But I'd definitely mention the difference to the Erpheronians in the entry. That age is showing faster at these guys (grey mingling hair) would fit perhaps also to their rugged look. But that's just a suggestion.)

Most Kyranians had richly tanned and weathered skin due to the fact that they spent a good deal of their lives outside. Working, training, trading, and participating in events, which usually took place under the sun, took up a good deal of the hours of the day. Nobles that were overly concerned with their looks and had no interest in prematurely aged skin usually kept to the castle and held events in their rooms. There were a few of those types of peoples throughout the kingdom and the years, but they were mostly shunned by all except the ones with similar contempt for the life style of their people. They formed one of the rings of power in the General Court. When they weren’t tied up in matters of state, the other half of the nobility would be out under the sun, tending to their business.

The men had a rugged look, with a strong brow, high forehead, broad jaw, and faces weathered by the elements. They usually looked older before their time, their faces and bodies commonly scarred and worn by their mid-thirties from plying their trade and enjoying the outdoors. In the early years the close cropped ‘military style’ was the most common hair style among these men, but at the height of the kingdom, a new style broke out. The youth attempted something new, keeping their hair a bit longer, between their jaw and the middle of their ears.

The flaw appeared in the length of the cut, as it hindered the efforts of men and bothersome strands of hair usually found their way into the workers' face no matter how hard they tried to keep it back. This lead to the front being cut just above the eyes so that they could see, while the rest was allowed to be longer on the sides, and even longer in the back. Past the fall of the kingdom this remained the style for the young men that called themselves Kyranians, while the close cropped cut was common among the older men.

There were two signs of manhood among these people, though one is the true sign while the other is just seen as the symbol of a boy aging. The growth of a beard would be the symbol of a boy’s youth fleeing. All males wore a thin, neatly kept beard and mustache that lightly covered their jaw and upper lip. The men took pride in the upkeeping of their hair and beards as well as their bodies. They looked down upon scruffiness and untidiness.

The sign of manhood for a youth came at the age of fourteen. On their fourteenth birthday, the men of the family would take the youth to a tattooist to have the Kyranian Coat of Arms permanently embedded into his skin. The black and white inks of the stag head and star gem were planted into the tanned back of the boy. The process was slow and painful for the youth, but after the experience the boy was no longer seen as a boy, but a strong young man among his people. All Kyranians who could claim family were taken on their fourteenth birthday, but orphans were skipped over. Other than orphans, exiles are the only among the Kyranian men that had been forbidden rights. Family, home, and a job in the Kingdom of Kyrania were taken from them. They are also denied their heritage as those that are exiled by the court were captured and their tattoo burned off before they were escorted to the borders.

Kyranian women were just as hardened as the men, but their features were somewhat softer and bodies slimmer. While they were slimmer and softer, they held the fierce determination and strength of the Kyranians. The woman were proud, not foolishly so, but even the poorest peasant woman found the strength to hold her head high when around others and fight through the tough times. This showed in the way they moved with purpose, demonstrating strength beneath their concealing builds. Among the Kyranian woman, those that were single kept their hair about shoulder length, and usually loose around their head, kept out of their faces by folded headbands of dark cloth. Married women would let their hair grow longer and would keep it pulled back or braided throughout the day. Like the men, the women were equally as proud of their appearance, if not more so.

There are five classes of people that made up the Kyranian Society: nobility, men-at-arms/soldiers, merchants, craftsmen, and peasants. Their lives and appearances were somewhat different though not much. This depended on the life style they led, but they all had the same basic form, the exception being soldiers as they had the highest numbers of men that tended to have the uncommon larger size. This was because youths that showed signs of broader frames were conscripted into the King’s Service. This made the government unpopular to some people, but most youths found it easy to adapt to the new way of life and they were allowed a day or two each week to visit with their families. Kyranian peasant men had their differences as well and were mostly distinguished by their gnarled hands, weather beaten faces, smell of cattle or sheep and leather.

Coat of Arms.
The Kyranian coat of arms consists of a black stag's head on a dark green background with a gem in star-form placed between the antlers. The stag represents a central symbol in Kyranian heraldry, as the tribe interprets itself closely related to the God of the Hunt, Arvins. The gem on the other hand shows the one found by Cyroan Thromgolin at today's Lower Fores, which helped him to decide on the location of his first independent settlement of the tribe. Together the stag's head and the gem demonstrate prosperity and wealth.

Territory.
In the old days the Kyranian Kingdom ranged from the west side of the High Fores to the Bay of the Sky with the Dorashi River winding its way between the two, cutting the land in half from east to west. Many historic and mysterious landmarks are found within the ancient Kyranian boundaries. The Steppe of Kruswik dominated most of their territory, the poor soil of this huge area of land causing the Kyranians to turn toward the raising of livestock.

The west side of the High Fores marks the eastern boundaries of their ancient territory, with the Lower Fores standing between that and the Steppe of Kruswik. On the west side of Lower Fores, the Ilian Plateau can be found, the beginnings of the Kingdom of Kyrania, where Cyroan Thromgolin built his fortress and empire. The Shivering Woods and the two Aerelian Lakes in the east are along the northwestern borders, stretching south to the southern end of the Lower Fores and the top of the Anaios Gap.

The capital of this ancient kingdom, Caelum, was built at the mouth of the Dorashi River and was called El'Dorash a long time ago. The name of the river came from the original name of the capital city. Another notable Kyranian city is Naios, which was founded on a hill near Wind Bay by Aprag Naios Dereswungen. When the kingdom fell in 806 b.S the other tribes began annexing the land and the Kyranians slowly went extinct (Extinct is quite a harsh word, I don't know if it is true. They were assimilated into another society, and the core of the Kyranians might have diminished dramatically, but they still existed in a way, no?). Now their old territory is part of the Xaramon Province.

---------------

So much for now, hope this helps for a start! More comments still to come :)
« Last Edit: 06 August 2008, 17:21:40 by Artimidor Federkiel » Logged



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« Reply #19 on: 06 August 2008, 19:32:29 »

This will take a while to read through...

Regarding the continued existence of the Kyranians as a tribe, like I said, it's possible.  However, I think it is somewhat less likely than the Eyelians' survival, since as far as I know, unlike the Eyelians, another tribe (the Centoraurians) has had quite a lot of influence over Kyranian territory even before they joined Tharania.  So it's also quite possible, I think, that they could have been assimilated into the Centoraurians.  Perhaps they form a distinct branch of the Centoraurians, much like the Helcrani do? 

I see the kingdom referred to as having fell in 806 b.S.  While that certainly seems true, the fact that they had a king to overthrow in 482 b.S seems to suggest that the kingdom was revived some time before that.  Well, I see that you mentioned that already in a previous post, but maybe it could be added to the entry too?  It should be a fairly significant thing, after all. 

The history section could perhaps also mention how some left to become the Helcrani. 
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« Reply #20 on: 07 August 2008, 03:39:07 »

Alright, I added and fixed things in Sea Green. I addressed everything (other than additions to the history section, which I will get around to after getting something to eat) hopefully. Though one thing I purposely left for the time was the past tense in the appeance section.

I added a bit at the beginning of that and after putting that bit in I wasn't sure if I should switch it. I figured if I still needed too it would be a fairly easy switch, but if I didn't need to it would be pointless to switch it then switch it back. As soon as I know which it will be done.

As for the nomenclature bit, I didn't think to have it work with Dietych as I didn't see him as part of the Tribe. It might be best not to include it as its not just history bits that this is named and to fit in with my set system at the moment, the 'T' would need to be doubled.

Changing some of the names in the history section would be a ton of help as I was trying to work through some ideas for a couple of the names (mostly in the Scions of Thromgolin) and was going to try to pull of something about their father being an avid traveler.  grin Anyways, I'll get to work on some stuff in the history section later today hopefully.

Though, for nobility, I put that the second name of a high ranked noble wasn't allowed to be used as names among anyone in the Kingdom. I'll try to come up with a list of "Noble Second Names that were commonly restricted" soon. Right now I'm drawing blanks on more everything and pretty much worn out at the moment. Hopefully I can come up with something though.

Thank you for taking your time to look through this and comment. I await more comments. :)

Edits: Added and fixed some stuff in the history. Also, looked and found a few names I'd be hard pressed to accomidate and they just wouldn't fit into the naming system. Hopefully its not too much trouble to change them.

Former Name: Gil'Landene Thromgolin / New Name: Gilden 'Gil' Thromgolin
Former Name: Ylin'Sengren Thromgolin / New Name: Senren 'Ren' Thromgolin
Former Name: Cyro'Unane Thromgolin / New Name: Cyrobaltt 'Cyro' Thromgolin
Former Name: Viginold Dereswungen / New Name: Jalttren 'Jaltt' Dereswungen
Former Name: Aprag Naios Dereswungen / New Name: Narinos 'Naios' Dereswungen
« Last Edit: 01 September 2008, 06:28:48 by Garret Arroway » Logged

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« Reply #21 on: 07 August 2008, 17:27:20 »

Okeydokey, I continue along with this monster... ;)

People.
Many people today still hold with the rustic image that comes to mind when thinking about the Kyranians. Even their city folk were outdoor people and their lower class was known for their cattle farming and some horse breeding. They were also hunters and worshipers of the Huntlord Arvins. Their nobility was also known for their plain clothing and working class ways as they spent a good deal of their days working under the sun, whether it be weapon training or perusing a craft, such as wood working. Though the only people that didn't fit into that image were the flamboyantly dressed merchants who drew the attention of those in the marketplace by their 'out of the ordinary' styles and colours.

These people were known for their simplicity. Most of their works had a simple design to them that drew the eye of the looker without being overly flashy or showy. This reflected their lives, as they usually blended in with the crowd but were easily picked out by their slender frame, dark hair, and tanned, sometimes leathery, skin. Their lives were ruled by the little things and the simple pleasures, such as the company of good friends and a full mug of ale after a days work. They are also known for being rather direct people who don't toy around with words when they are not needed and sometimes prefer silence over all else. As said, the simple things in life catch their eye as they don't understand those that complicate things and make the days harder.

(As you can see here in that last sentence you switch to present tense here for a bit, so that fits directly to the issue I addressed above that they are still in some way existing today. They were/are more a folk that prefer the quiet, the simply life, and thus perhaps succumbed to outer influences/occupations easier, yet this musn't necessarily have caused their utter eradication. - You get in some trouble regularly throughout the entry by treating everything as if it is all gone.)

They were also proud, as were all their people, but not foolishly so. They knew how to pick their fights (though they learned the hard way as hot-headed youths) and knew what battles they could win. They were also proud when it came to their appearance and they worked each day at keeping themselves as well as their lives in order. This went of all of the classes of Kyranians. (Is that an expression? Don't know that one.)

The peasants were known for their rural nature, sound, and short-cut version of speech, as they preferred to lump words together and drop letters where they weren't needed. Their life out on the Steppe, raising cattle, horses, sheep, chickens, and other livestock was an easy one with a set daily routine that they found comforting. Each morning they would wake up, knowing exactly what needed to be done and how long it would take to do it (usually the entire day), knowing their place in the world.

Craftsmen as well enjoy (Tense- thingy...) the knowledge of what the next day will bring. They knew everything within their workroom, how everything worked, what was needed for what projects, and how long it would take to complete a task. Most of the time they worked within their own realm, letting the days waste away as they did their job, seeking perfection in the smallest things, like a single stitch in a shirt or single horse shoe made out of dozens. The one thing that was different was that they couldn't fall into the same routine each day, but they worked to the requests of customers, merchants, or nobles depending on their jobs.

Soldiers, sailors, knights, guards, and pathfinders seemed the most at ease at their jobs, selected by their interests, skills, and knowledge. They had a routine set by others above them for each day, allowing them to fall into their lives with ease, be it practice sessions, drills, the running of a ship, or just sulking through the brush for game trails, they felt at home within their environment. Those that had the privilege of working with a warg during the Time of the Wargriders felt more at home than ever and for a couple hundred years the beasts became a somewhat common sight.

I checked back with the wargs entry, where it isn't very clear that wargs still were around in 1406 b.S. in Southern Sarvonia, where the Kyranians obviously already lived and trained them. Maybe this should be mentioned there as well more clearly.

Nobles had a different system. They complicated small things in the ways the common folk didn’t and attempted to avoid. Pride was a big concern among these people, more so than the rest of their folk, allowing comments that would commonly 'slide off the common folk' (A bit of a repetition here...) be taken as an insult to their name and family. Many duels were fought among the nobility for both reasons of pride and fun bouts among friends. Some of these battles begun from insults ended in friendship or life-long feuds that seemed pointless in the eyes of many.

One of the most notable ways that they complicated things was the system put in, allowing the younger sons or daughters of nobility the right to claim the position of heir to their family name, lands, and coin. Three tests were offered to any daughter or younger child of nobility. They were used to test the strength of the challenger and the named heir, put in place to allow the others a chance they were denied by being born second or being born a daughter. The three tests were a test of weapon skills, a test of hunting skills, and a test of knowledge. The child/young adult that won two out of three of the tests was declared ‘heir’ and could claim their fathers/mothers title, lands, and coin upon his death or 'retirement' (the parent stepping back when they aged to allow a new voice to speak for their land).

(Maybe you could give this system a certain name, then we can put a caption in front of it to make it easier to find it. Maybe these tests could be linked to their belief in Arvins, so that it is thought that it is a fair decision actually made with a godly consent? Yet that a good hunter can always improve, so it is in the individual's hand to make a new challenge.)

If the contest ended in a 2-1 win, the winner could be challenged again at a later date, but if it was a 3-0 win, they could not be challenged again, even if a younger sibling wished a chance to win their families fortune, status, and rank within court. A tie in one event would be decided by a battle with the weapon of the Kyranians, the Sengren, to first blood. The only time the ‘heir’ could be challenged after a 3-0 win, was if the father/mother (person holding the office) requested another child as an ‘heir’ before their death. This rarely happened during the lifespan of the kingdom as it caused feuds between families that could wage for years and end in the destruction of the house. Many believed this to be against the entire lifestyle of the Kyranians, but then again, no one said the nobility of any tribe was ever sane or thought rationally when it came to honour.

Housing.
(The following in my personal interpretation is somewhat problematic. It goes way too much into details on how medieval castles look like. It is surely well researched, the problem of course here is that the Kyranian accentuation is somewhat missing. What is typically Kyranian, what expressed their way of life? How exactly is this reflected in the architecture in comparison to e.g. an Erpheronian fortress? So ideally this shouldn't be so much on where what room lies exactly in a castle, but how Kyranian life represents itself in it. As it is, this part leads more away from the inital intention of why this section was created. Especially as you refer to it in the past tense, it all doesn't seem to deal with Kyranians and what we need to know about them.  huh )

In the Kyranian Kingdom castles made of stone, with some wood buildings were rather large. These buildings housed all of the nobles, knights, court officials, staff, and attendants in the area and lived in the castle with a majority of the army. While the main keeps of these castles usually were four or five stories tall, with the towers being taller, the stone mansion usually covered a good deal of land. Most landowning nobility would live at the castle in their area and use their sons or a trusted attendant to check on their tenants once every two weeks or so to make sure that things were running properly. This opened up more good land for ranching and farming and large castles could be built on land that was poorly suited for crops and cattle. The Kyranians attempted to put everything they could to good use.

Lavish courtyards usually led to the main keep. In no way were they small, but they were not overly large either. These areas were well kept and the plants that surrounded the walkway were more than decoration. The plants were commonly selected by the head cook and would provide spices, seasonings, vegetables, and fruits for the meals, while flower growing plants were sometimes harvested to bring a little life to rooms of the keep. The courtyards were a favourite of the castle staff and many of the noble women felt themselves drawn to the simple labours of gardening during their days. In the later days of the kingdom, the courtyards were left to their original purpose though some of the lords of the castle had to sacrifice half or all of their gardens to erect temporary barracks. Behind the courtyard was a large open area that consisted of tournament grounds, training grounds, and the stables, temporary barracks, and smithy/armoury.

The courtyards usually led directly to the great hall that hosted an array of tapestries that depicted the lord’s greatest moments and the history of the Kingdom. A long, solid wooden table typically ran the length of the room, which depended on the size of the castle. A lesser hall also occupied the ground floor. It was rarely used but on festival days the hall was packed with the lesser folk of the city as they enjoyed the lord’s hospitality. The kitchen was almost always to the left of the great hall and was constantly busy cooking the daily meals. The final part of the ground floor was a servant’s quarters, these were commonly two long rooms filled with narrow bunks.

Beneath the stones of the ground floor lies a whole separate level. A staircase in the court yard leads down to the Soldier’s barracks, which are usually located under the kitchen. The barracks are carefully and solidly built beneath the keep. Each hall could hold between hundred and two hundred men in the three level bunks that take up as much room as possible, leaving barely enough walking space for the men. Wooden posts were set as the stone were put into the rooms, keeping the soldier’s beds safe. Bunk halls could be found all around beneath the castle, as they are expanded when they need to. Along with the bunk halls, a common room/mess hall is built beneath the kitchen. A gently declining ramp runs the length of the hall, allowing the kitchen staff to descend safely with food for the soldiers. Hallways throughout the underground level led to various rooms for soldiers, but they also lead to the cells that resided beneath the keep. Only the most dangerous were kept beneath the keeps.

The second flood of the keep was dedicated to the craftsmasters that worked for the lord of the keep, allowing them a workroom and private quarters. The craftsmasters, apprentices, and castle staff commonly had a small mess hall about the kitchen, with a staircase that led down to the food. They could enjoy their meals there, but this was only present on the largest castles and the staff usually dinned in the lesser hall. The third and/or fourth floor was set aside the lords closest members at court. The top level was usually the fourth or fifth and it was the smallest of floors, and it was inhabited only by the lord of the castle and its family.

Various towers and stone buildings surrounded the main keep, the towers standing five to six stories tall, some even reaching seven, while the buildings rarely reached four stories. The towers either had a staircase on the inside, lining the wall or on the outside with a railing that kept others from falling. Each level of the tower held a medium sized private dining/meeting room and a simple furnished room or two. The bottom of the towers had more rooms while the top floor commonly had one room. Nobles with larger families would be situated in the lower level rooms while single nobility would be assigned the top rooms. The towers levels were one set of rooms on their own while the buildings were set up similarly with more sets of rooms per level.

Merchants lived in wooden or stone (or both) two or three story structures near the castle or in a city. Most of the time the first floor of their home was turned into their store and large windows were built in the front to display the merchant's wears on days with bad weather. Buildings were often a few peds back from the street and had heavy wooden or stone tables out front where merchants could set up for a day of business. The upper levels of the house were the living quarters for the owners and their families. The wealthier merchants had homes in another section of the city that were solely for living and owned buildings or warehoused in other areas where they conducted business. The poorer or beginning merchants had two story buildings with half the first level blocked off and they lived in the back part while they rented out the top story to another familiar. It is not uncommon for new merchants to share a home with a supplier until they both get on their feet.

The craftsmen of the city usually lived in one or two story buildings, depending on their wealth. In two story buildings, a small front room would be set aside for customers with a workroom in the back and their home on the second floor. A lot of craftsmen had two separate workrooms one being indoors with all their tools and materials while the other consisted of a sturdy work area behind their home/work where they could enjoy the sun while doing simple takes that didn't need a good deal of set up and equipment. Those that lived in one story buildings had their workroom up front and open to the eyes of customers while their living quarters in the back depended on wealth.

The housing of the peasants usually consisted of a wooden one story thatched roofed structure. Those that lived within the city were often in another area of the city and worked at their craft within their homes. These houses were rather small and consisted of two or three rooms with a cooking area and a working area. The working area was often used for guests as well. Peasants that didn't have a license from the King to trade would manufacture goods in their homes and sell them to merchants who in turn would sell them to others. The peasants that lived outside of the city and made their living as ranchers or farmers, resided in slightly larger houses with another large barn or warehouse near by for animals or crops.

(Here the later paragraphs are more important than the first ones, where a castle is analyzed so thoroughly. The Kyranian aspects however don't feature very prominently nevertheless, which they actually should. Especially when you try to establish the Kyranians as a more rustic folk, outdoor people that enjoy cattle farming and horse breeding, this should be stressed considerably in the descirption.)

More comments to come later...
« Last Edit: 07 August 2008, 17:29:42 by Artimidor Federkiel » Logged



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« Reply #22 on: 07 August 2008, 18:32:54 »

Alright, I'll tackle this next bit tomorrow as its almost 2:30am here and I'm offically wiped. I just thought I'd post real quick as I'm unsure about the past/present thing. I don't want to go back and have to convert it to present and then do it again, back to the past if it doesn't work. Are there just certain sections that should be past tense and others that should be present? Or should the whole thing be present?
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« Reply #23 on: 08 August 2008, 03:13:50 »

Still unsure about what should be present and what shouldn't. When I was writing this I was under the impression that they were extinct. So most of it will be in past tense with some present tense as I switched from time to time accidently. Think I caught most of it when writing, but some will come back up.

About the Wargs. Me and Tharoc are working on revising that entry. There will be alot going into that with an overview and different types. We still need to hammer out the details, which we should be doing soon, as well as places and warg types. We'd talked a bit about putting one down in the south. At that time they would have been wide spred, but the plan is to keep them mostly to the forested areas in that territory now and keep the population down after they were heavily hunted down. There is more about that later on and I have other entries planned to come soon on that.

I've added, deleted, and moved some stuff in the Housing section. That was one of the first sections and I hadn't really established alot, and was just trying to give an overview of the basic layout of these massive castles. Any there was very little research done, I just read way too many books . grin Anyways, hopefully I was able to fix that will leaving a real basic overview.

Thats all I got for now. Thanks for getting through those sections. :) Oh and the second set of edits are still in Sea Green. If I used a new color for the next patch of edits each time I'd be out before it was finished.
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« Reply #24 on: 08 August 2008, 04:06:21 »

Quote
At that time they would have been wide spred, but the plan is to keep them mostly to the forested areas in that territory now and keep the population down after they were heavily hunted down.

Well, since you have Kyranians using them, and Kyranian territory seems to have more steppe than forest, how about having one type that mostly lives in steppes and grasslands? 
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« Reply #25 on: 08 August 2008, 05:02:36 »

I had planned on them living mostly on the steppe and grasslands until they were hunted down on a larger scale than before, during which time they retreated the the little forested area they could, though some still roam outside of the forests. Just my idea for it.
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« Reply #26 on: 08 August 2008, 05:40:40 »

Well, I don't know how well a species that mostly lived in open spaces can adapt to living in forests, but then I'm no zoologist.  Anyway, let's not derail this thread any further.  I'm sure you and Tharoc know what you're doing.  :)
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« Reply #27 on: 08 August 2008, 06:26:13 »

To furtherly derail and hopefully terminate that particular barrel of Wargs, it depends  on to which degree the animal has specialised into functioning in one particular environment. If you look at modern-day wolves, then are quite capable of hunting on the plains, as well as chasing prey through a forest, so i'd say Garret's furry friends should be just fine.
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« Reply #28 on: 08 August 2008, 16:57:40 »

Ok, checking some more:

Clothing.
(Maybe split the section here up a bit, so that we can have captions - for nobility, lower classes etc. If one wants to find something specific in an entry, we should make it as easy as we possibly can to categorize things properly.)
The Kyranian nobility rarely looked their part since those that spent most of their day’s outdoors resorted clothing that was more functional and rarely was it extravagantly decorated. Sleeveless or short-sleeve shirts of cotton, linen, or animal hide were most common among the men (and sometimes women) during the late spring and summer months. Loose pants of the same material and leather boots between ankle and calf high pretty much completed the look of male nobility. During the cold months, simple short or long sleeved shirts were covered by fur-lined or wool jackets and/or thick fur-trimmed cloaks. A simple leather belt or baldric with a serviceable dagger or sword was almost always seen as these people rarely steped out of their room without some sort of protection. Those males that chose to flaunt their status and tend to be classified as ‘vain’ were constantly teased. It was commonly said that those men spent more money and time on one outfit than another man spent in a month.

The females among the nobility were a bit different, but nearly as ‘improper’ as the men in the eyes of other groups of people. Noble women could be classified in two groups – those that stood by and watched, or proper women, and those that joined the group. The latter tended to wear the same thing that the men wore as they joined in the training, games, and hunts that the men tended to busy themselves with from time to time. The ‘proper women’ were commonly present during these events as well though they stayed back from the action. The women were mostly seen in plain, long dresses or cotton or linen, often in various colours. Long skirts and shirts with various lengths of sleeves was also the normal dress during the days. The winter months found these women exchanging the lighter fabrics for thicker, fur-lined or woolen clothing. While openly carrying a weapon wasn’t very ‘lady-like', the proper woman would carry a small dagger concealed within sleeves or beneath skirts so that they weren’t completely venerable.

The more formal and sometimes flamboyant clothing of the nobility was often drawn out after the sun was set with court gatherings, social dinners, state functions, and other official settings that called for the upper class to show their status. Various layers and colours of clothing were seen and the current style was constantly changing. One month the high, still collar might mark a man of high class and money, and another it would be the symbol of those of a lower rank. A badge of office was a requirement at most functions as these patches showed the attending nobles' ranks.

Some merchants were mistaken for nobles when foreigners would enter a Kyranian city, as they wore colourful clothing of varying styles that ranged from the plain shirt and pants combination to multiple shirts of different sizes and colours arranged to draw attention. The gaudily clad men usually drew the most attention as they could be picked out in a crowd, but sometimes the colourful clothing had the opposite effect and potential customers would avoid that particular person. Along with that, merchants commonly wore overly long capes, even in the summer months, which could cover or expose the knife or sword that usually hung at their side. Some even had a crossbow or belt with a couple throwing knives hanging within reach and sight to ward off a thief’s nimble fingers. While some of these weapons were for show, many were taught a little of self defense and could probably wield the weapon they wore.

The craftsmen of the city commonly resembled the peasants. Even the richest craftsman in the city usually wore plain shirts in pants; either homespun or purchased from one of the seamstresses throughout the city. Most of these people found their work to be rather rough on nice clothing and preferred something comfortable and durable over the other options. Those that had somewhat cozier occupations might lean (tense!) toward nicer clothing from time to time, but practical clothing was always needed for those accustomed to long days of work. When out and about they might lose the garments and tools of their trade (such as a leather apron and work belt for a blacksmith), but within their workrooms, they were always in sight, marking the man's (or woman's) trade.

Peasants wore pretty much what ever they could. Homespun shirts and pants were the most commonly seen. While they couldn’t afford the better materials, they still had enough to keep themselves and their families well clad throughout the years. Those that lived outside the city were rather well off, but males still worked without a shirt when they could to preserve the clothes they had.

Diet.
The Kyranians were considered lucky as some of the finest cattle. (You surely mean "as they possessed some of the finest cattle", don't you? ;) ) The Kyrattin, as this beast is called now, was more commonly known as the "Longhorn" because their horns can range from two peds to two peds and two fores from the tip of one horn to the tip of the other. (Can/was etc. - tenses problems here again as throughout most of the entry.) This was the most common animal farmed for food in that area along with sheep, chickens, pigs, and horses (though the last wasn't commonly eaten by the Kyranians). The wild herds of deer, cattle, and other animals on the Steppe of Kruswik found themselves targets of both of the most dangerous predators on the land, humans and wargs.

With the Steppe of Kruswik taking up a good deal of the territory, the land available for growing fruits, vegetables, and other such things was uncommon and those that were privileged enough to work those lands had a very busy life. Small forested areas provided a good deal of the fruit of the Kyranian kingdom and a lot of variations of common vegetables strived for a while before failing with the passing of years after attempts to adapt them to different environments. Dried and jarred fruits and vegetables brought in by merchant ships and caravans became the most commonly seen during the harsher seasons on the Steppe.

Weapons.
It was fairly rare to catch one of these people without a weapon. Just because the eye couldn’t see one didn’t mean that person was unarmed. These people were fairly cautious and even the lowest members of society had something to protect them. The weapons ranged from blades to bows with slings, staves, and rocks thrown in the mix.

The pride of the Kyranian arsenal was a double bladed axe called the "Sengren". This unique weapon was crafted by the middle Thromgolin brother, Ylin’Sengren, in 9550 b.S. and obviously was named after him. One blade was large, thick and strong enough to hew down logs or the legs of armoured horses. The other blade was crafted in the shape of a crescent moon and had a razor sharp inside to cut the tendons of horses as they passed by. Finally, the top of the blade was hardened steel, hard enough to pierce the strongest armour. (Tense, tense tense. Makes trouble everywhere. The weapon surely is still around as some Kyranians still are.)

Among the nobility the Sengren was used, along with a variety of other weapons. Between eight and ten years of age the sons (and sometimes daughters) of nobility would start weapon training. For the first year and a half to two years they were taught the basics of various weapons. Every couple months they were tested and were shifted into groups that worked to establish each boy's (or girl's) skill. After the child was matched with a weapon they would move into a group that worked only with that weapon. Children of lesser nobility would train with others while those of more important families might have (tense!) a private trainer.

After the youth had been matched with a weapon they would move into other groups and spend most of their mornings in training. They would work in at least three groups. One focused on the Sengren, one focused on a ranged weapon, and the last focused on a type of sword, spear, axe, or other weapon offered at the castle. They worked with each until they reached manhood (fourteen years of age). At that point they could drop one or more of the weapons if they had no skill. Their trainer’s consent was needed most times, but some went to a higher authority (parents, but they were often overruled) or took it upon themselves to remove themselves from the training.

Those that were in the Kyranian military were trained in the weapon commonly used in their branch (army, navy, guard, knights, hunters/pathfinders, and the Royal Guard) and unit. The army pretty much matched man and weapon and put them in a unit with others that wielded the same weapon. They navy had a narrower selection of weapons. Most recruits were trained with the bow and cutlass or long knives for a time before they were assigned to a ship. They other branches had their own weapon preferences.

Most merchants kept some sort of weapon on them. Swords, knives, daggers, and crossbows were seen the most with some more exotic weapons displayed every now and then. Between fourteen and eighteen years of age the newly proclaimed adults were thrust into weapon training by their parent. A retired soldier or city guard was hired by the merchants most of the time. Those that didn’t train with a weapon still kept one near by, the crossbow and knives having been a favourite of the untrained. This was an attempt to intimidate those that might be brave enough to try their hand at the thieves’ life.

Most craftsmen were untrained in the use of a weapon but those that were rarely carried something that could be considered a real weapon. Anything sharp, heavy, or malevolent looking worked for these people and more often than not they could do more damage with the tools of their trade than another weapon. A blacksmith might carry a hammer in his belt instead of a sword he crafted. On the other hand a bowyer might carry one of the weapons he made instead of the tool he used to make it. Some won’t risk doing damage to their tools while others trust in the strength of their livelihood.

Untrained peasants used pretty much anything to defend themselves. Knives, staves, slings, and rope were mostly seen but if need be anything could have been turned into a weapon. Farm tools or even the leg of a wooden chair would be a better tool than nothing in times of need. However, Kyranian peasants seemed to excel with the sling and were known to be excellent shots. Of course the youth with a rock could also cause some trouble and pain.

Basically, various things that I mentioned above, apply here as well to a degree. What I considerably miss is a very distinctive Kyranian accentuation. The tribes is introduced to us as hunters, as devout people following the Huntlord Arvins, as rustic people that domesticated cattle, maybe a peace-loving folk that avoids conflicts - but even the latter isn't very thoroughly established. If you look at other tribe entries like the Erpheronians, Eyelians or the Avennorians, then you will notice that these entries try to get to the bottom of the tribe's identity. Which reflects in their weapons, their clothing, how they name things. Every little piece that tries to reflect on the central theme of the tribe is extremely valuable to establish that tribe as an own, even if you only invent a name, say, for the Kyranian army, which must have been different somehow from other armies, if you take the tribe's basic principles into account. In other tribes we even have different names for kings and leaders, just to show this considerable difference.

So, yeah, in many parts some sections feel way too general and little Kyranian, it shouldn't read as if it could be substituted with any other tribe. I'd say take your time to look at a section, and see where you might add something typically Kyranian, where you can change names and focus towards the Kyranian orientation. If you have the principles of the tribe worked out thoroughly, this isn't as difficult as it might look like on the first glance! ;) And if these principles are still missing some elements, maybe define some more first, which you can later rely on to make things very prominently featured in a section here and there.

P.S. I will look at Nomenclature next and feed the name generator with your syllables, in order to generate some distinctive Kyranian names.
« Last Edit: 08 August 2008, 21:01:31 by Artimidor Federkiel » Logged



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« Reply #29 on: 08 August 2008, 21:00:49 »

Ok, next is Nomenclature as I said:

Nomenclature.
Kyranian names bounced around between common and uncommon, short and long, odd and original. There are those that believe there was no reasoning behind the odd names bestowed upon the children during the first two generations of the kingdom (I would suggest "early generations" instead. Remember, this all happened millenia ago, and it is not that we know everything in full detail what happened there. We try to make way too many things very concrete, which happened in times of ages past, where here on Earth there are no reliable sources at all.). During those times, children of common birth were often given bits of the names of their family members. From two to four or five members of the family might have been honoured with a part of their names used in the naming of a newborn. After the first few generations, a true naming system came out of the 'honour system' as some researchers refer to it as.

Some found it pointless that first names were used as last names as well, but it made perfect sense to the Kyranians. A man would carry his own first name and his last name would be a full of shortened version of his father's first name. For a woman it would be the same except that she carried her mother's first name as her last name. Though last names were rarely used outside nobility and some of the lesser folk would have forgotten their last name had it not been the mother or father's first name. Among the nobility, the same last name was passed down from generations, but it was still the first name from some ancient ancestor. Most of the time the last names of nobility were forbidden for the common people to use so that there was only one family with that name.

Within first names there were a few rules and common letter combinations that were followed throughout the years. For reasons lost in history, the first rule was that vowels could not be used as the first letter in a person's first name. Many believe that this might be because the middle syllables were simply 'a', 'e', 'i', 'o', and 'u' with 'y' added as a middle syllable for women. In the many years that the Kyranian Kingdom thrived, only one name recorded began with vowel (Aprag Naios Dereswungen) and bits of history lead us to believe he wasn't full-blooded Kyranian. (I guess you suggested already a change for that one, so make sure to adjust that passage here as well accordingly.)

Another rule is the double 't' within the name. At the beginning of the name the single 't' is acceptable, but within the name, all 't's are doubled. Along with these rules a few repeated letter groupings stand out. The first being the 'ya', 'yar', and 'yr', which were most commonly used in the names of nobility until the Era of Cataclysm, and while the reasoning behind that was never recorded, many believe the War of the Chosen humbled much of the nobility. The second grouping is the 'aw' which is found more through male names than female.

Middle names seemed of little importance to these people, but when names were cataloged, three names were listed. The middle name was often a shortened version of the person's first name. Even the shortest names could be shortened and the longest names kept as they were depending on the person's preference.

Ok, when checking the list of syllables I saw that you use some syllables for female and male endings, making them impossible to distinguish the gender. Should be fixed - decide the gender of those please! Here they are:

-an
-att
-er
-matt
-tter

Another problematic syllable is "nar", which you have as a male beginning and a female ending, a weird construction that my SNG cannot dealt with at the moment. As this is the only problematic syllable in this regard, I would suggest that you pick a side here as well and let it be either male or female.

Then a question concerning the "middle syllable": How exactly would you have it used? Would all Kyranian names be basically 3-syllable words? Beginning-middle-ending? With the middle syllable being used obligatorily. Or are there 2-syllable words possible?
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