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Author Topic: Fisah-eck-Shanno "Snowflake", Gathorn Mountains, Insect  (Read 20890 times)
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Ta`lia of the Seven Jewels
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« Reply #30 on: 19 June 2009, 17:24:48 »

Remaom, I see now, where your problem comes from. But not to clutter this thread further, I will open a new one. Soon :)

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« Reply #31 on: 20 June 2009, 00:29:04 »

By purging anything in their guts and sometimes ridding their bodies of bacteria, insects can withstand temperatures well below freezing. Keith Miller, a former UAF biologist, found that larvae of the gall wasps, which spend winter in fuzzy little balls on the surface of willow leaves, can avoiding freezing down to minus 60 by adding glycerol to their body fluids.

A quote from someone wi' more knowledge than me. Can be found in the link I supplied above, erm, a while back. Mebe The Snowflake jus' makes more glycerol or alchohol t' keep from freezin'.
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« Reply #32 on: 20 June 2009, 02:25:21 »

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By keeping the liquid inside the cells from freezing, the glycerol protects the larva's delicate cell membranes from being destroyed by ice crystals. The rest of the larva can freeze solid

As you said yourself, they spend that time rolled up in balls, not actually functioning.

I know of no living being that is active with insides that are in sub freezing temperatures. Maybe some bacteria whos simple designs allow them to do amazing things, but probably not too much below freezing, if any.
« Last Edit: 20 June 2009, 03:52:41 by Remaom » Logged
Altario Shialt-eck-Gorrin
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« Reply #33 on: 20 June 2009, 02:47:17 »

Just because you know of none, does not mean that there cannot be some here in Santharia; which is not Earth, but Caelereth.  My bugs do not need a heat source, they are perfectly adapted to living in a frozen environment.  Their biology is suited for that, and as we do not have molecular biologist here yet, that will have to suffice.  Perhaps it is something to do with hosts who eat hrugchuk grass, which also grows and does not freeze here.  Regardless, the how is not as much as important here as the fact that they do survive.
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Miraran Tehuriden
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« Reply #34 on: 20 June 2009, 02:50:48 »

I know of no living being that is active in sub freezing temperatures.

Uhm. Penguins?

Also, myself when i go ice skating..
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« Reply #35 on: 20 June 2009, 03:03:35 »

 I was clearly talking about internal temperatures. Penguins and humans create their own heat.

@ Altario

I see, a clever idea. Which means the next generation will die out in the cold  if the previous generation did not feed on something that did not have hrugchuk grass somewhere in it's diet chain.. It might be interesting if the entry had a theory of hrugchuk grass. Perhaps someone observed that these snow bugs did not survive after hatching out of someone not of the region.

 But might it be interesting if they did create their own heat? A way for someone in the know to know their goose was cooked, shortly before it is.

« Last Edit: 20 June 2009, 03:08:43 by Remaom » Logged
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« Reply #36 on: 20 June 2009, 03:10:46 »

Correct, if they do not feed in a fairly short period of time, they will die.  Which is why they emerge from the froth when a host gets close enough to attack.  In spring, when most froths open, most of the insects do die, which makes the Gathorn Range a dangerous place to travel at that time of year, and helps to limit their spread of territory.

One of the dangers of commenting on a rough draft, is that not everything has been written down yet.  But, I do appreciate all comments, so keep them coming.

I will give you a +1 aura for the comments, and the interest shown.  Though, I hope that you do not argue too zealously with others who may not agree with your assessments.
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« Reply #37 on: 20 June 2009, 03:32:41 »

Also very interesting, I am liking this entry more. But I am not sure what you are responding to Altario. I had the idea that if it was the grass, that maybe they wouldn't be able to survive subfreezing temperatures at all if coming from/having fed upon a host that didn't have the grass in his/her system. A vegan or a recent traveler from a warmer climate for example

Quote
 Though, I hope that you do not argue too zealously with others who may not agree with your assessments.

Ok, I will keep that in mind.

Another benefit to figuring out how something works, you invariably make it more complex/'deep' and interesting.
« Last Edit: 20 June 2009, 03:42:29 by Remaom » Logged
Miraran Tehuriden
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« Reply #38 on: 20 June 2009, 03:36:39 »

*sighs* You simply dont need to reason out their cold-proof-ness, if you dont want to. The amount of options for biochemically realistic compounts you could use to make a freeze-proof insect is simply astonishing. The fact none of them would be, in reality, available on earth is irrelevant. We dont have to abide to the laws of evolution and natural selection, since Caelereth is a creationistic universe.

edit-> and i resent the notion of eating vegans :P we've never hurt anyone!
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Avrah Kehabhra

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« Reply #39 on: 20 June 2009, 04:56:46 »

Remaom, have you seen my "Essential Developement Hints" I wrote for you?

Can anyone please set the link, I'm lost when I sit on another comp, be it windows or Ubuntu.
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Altario Shialt-eck-Gorrin
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« Reply #40 on: 20 June 2009, 04:58:23 »

Link set. :D
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« Reply #41 on: 20 June 2009, 13:08:37 »

"earlier than thpose with six"
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Remaom
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« Reply #42 on: 20 June 2009, 13:41:43 »

Considering the bit in yellow where you go on about the number of legs.

First, the technical name for that general catagory of creature including the likes of insects and spiders is arthropod.(I had to look that up BTW because I had forgotten) So if your not sure what smaller category to put them under...  All insects have six legs, both as larva and adults, while many arthropods do not.

So if you are considering them as arthropods then the discussion of the number of legs is unnecessary. If you feel a need to call them insects, it might clash with real world stuff, but that is alright, right? Either way, whether getting technical or not, there is no need for that bit, I recommend taking it out.

And of course, if the researcher is going to go on about a unusual factor of the creature, it should be it being a (normally cold blooded) arthropod able to function in the cold. Reason given or not, even on Santharia that must be highly unusual.
« Last Edit: 20 June 2009, 13:49:43 by Remaom » Logged
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« Reply #43 on: 20 June 2009, 17:17:27 »

We don't have the word arthropod in Caelereth, so the crawly critters are all insects, unless they are obviously something else (Lopsteres, Crabbes, Spiders, etc.) A milipede is an insect with a lot of legs, as far as we are concerned.

Anyway, as you can see from the posticon, this entry is not ready to be commented on yet, so lets all just see what happens if we leave it be untill the icon changes.
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Avrah Kehabhra

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« Reply #44 on: 21 June 2009, 01:28:11 »

Heh.. thanks Mira, I was thinking the same thing on the insect issue.. they're bugs, every creepy crawly we got.

As well, this is the most "popular" of any entry I've ever done that has not gotten beyond the initial "jot something down" phase.  Not sure what has grabbed the attention, but its both very welcome as far as the comments go, but I'm not sure everyone realizes that it is very much in the rough draft stage of development. :D
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