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Author Topic: Kaaer'dar'shin Dagger  (Read 16887 times)
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Azhira Styralias
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« Reply #15 on: 29 May 2010, 06:47:16 »

Like I said...

Valan will describe this as a dagger with two sharpened sides. That was how I envisioned this.

My people don't go to war armed with glorified steak knives.  :P
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No, I would not want to live in a world without dragons, as I would not want to live in a world without magic, for that is a world without mystery, and that is a world without faith. And that, I fear, for any reasoning, conscious being, would be the cruelest trick of all.
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« Reply #16 on: 29 May 2010, 21:19:08 »

Well Valan you don't look as smart as you appear.  grin

Quote
Tsor-Shotak bones are incredibly tough, and so the blade does not look as weak as it appears.


I love that oxymoron.
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Valan Nonesuch
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« Reply #17 on: 06 June 2010, 21:19:47 »

My people don't go to war armed with glorified steak knives.  :P
These are not steak knives.
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Altario Shialt-eck-Gorrin
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« Reply #18 on: 06 June 2010, 23:33:03 »

But it is a knife.  rolleyes
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Azhira Styralias
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« Reply #19 on: 07 June 2010, 08:17:33 »

I trust Valan-Bot to develop a suitably cunning and awe-inspiring weapon deadly enough for a Kaaer warrior. Be it "labeled" as a knife or dagger is irrelevant. As long as it fits the tribe is what matters.

There. Diplomatic enough for ya?  grin
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« Reply #20 on: 07 June 2010, 08:33:54 »

Nope  :P

Try again please  grin

But really ... you are a bunch of half orcs and orcs aren't known for being diplomatic. And I 'holidayed' with Altario up in Remusia recently ... those people can hardly be called 'civilised' either evil

So, I suppose that is about as 'diplomatic' as we can expect from our 'dear' friends from the far north.

In spite of that, I do love you guys heart pet grin
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« Reply #21 on: 07 June 2010, 09:15:24 »

Civilized is soooo over-rated. buck

Holidayed?  Guess that explains why you didn't work for your keep. rolleyes
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Valan Nonesuch
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« Reply #22 on: 14 June 2010, 02:41:29 »

I think I've finally sorted this out :D
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Azhira Styralias
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« Reply #23 on: 14 June 2010, 08:18:54 »

I'll uri this more thoroughly later, but for now a few comments.

- An entry on the dagger fighting style without mentioning the t'lark misses much of the Kaaer style. I thnk when researching the t'lark buckler I found several examples of how a smaller shield can be used with short blades effectively. The Kaaer are stealthy, quick fighters both on horse back and on foot.

- I would mention in the overview the t'lark and also the relationship to Durgho. The dagger is important to the tribe and can be considered a religious to'avatar. It is something sacred to the hunt.

- The origins can be defined as the tribe is not as old as some other Caelereth tribes. Likely, an old myth can go that the first Kaaer had to make weapons without the use of steel. So bone was the likely alternative, and fortunately, the Tsor-Shotak lizard was the best candidate.

- The Tsor-Shotak has dense bones that are heavier than similar sized creatures. If I need to revise the lizard entry to reflect that, I can. So a bone dagger of a Kaaer warrior is durable and tough and lighter than steel. But not as strong as bone can still break easier than steel.
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No, I would not want to live in a world without dragons, as I would not want to live in a world without magic, for that is a world without mystery, and that is a world without faith. And that, I fear, for any reasoning, conscious being, would be the cruelest trick of all.
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« Reply #24 on: 14 June 2010, 08:54:30 »

All solved
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« Reply #25 on: 20 June 2010, 12:03:07 »

I have an idea to give the Kaaer additional close quarters weapons such as punch daggers and claw bracers. The concept originates from the Kaaer's reverence of Durgho, the beast spirit, and the attempt to imitate the attacks of certain beasts. A claw bracer, for example, would function like the claw of the uncil cat. I am not sure how feasible that would be given the bone blades.
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No, I would not want to live in a world without dragons, as I would not want to live in a world without magic, for that is a world without mystery, and that is a world without faith. And that, I fear, for any reasoning, conscious being, would be the cruelest trick of all.
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« Reply #26 on: 20 June 2010, 16:07:35 »

A claw bracer, for example, would function like the claw of the uncil cat. I am not sure how feasible that would be given the bone blades.

Nothing to do with me, of course...but why not use an actual claw? Kind of like how people dressed up in leopard pelts to gain the reactions and strength of a leopard etc.?

Anyway, just an idea.
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« Reply #27 on: 21 June 2010, 10:01:47 »

Length of the claws, difficulty mounting the claws, procuring the claws. An uncil, is I believe a snow leopard. General appearance and judging by the fact that Rayne is the author and the latin name for the Snow Leopard is uncia uncia, I would say this a fair assumption.

I would not want to try to get those claws. Better to try to reproduce a similar mechanism for yourself.

@Azhira Punch daggers I could see working however. Perhaps doubling as an awl? They would be more easily made, close to the traditional bone knife, mounted into a piece of wood. Give me a second I might have a few ideas for you.

What other resources do the Kaaer have access to? And also, can we get a better name for this poor dagger?


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« Reply #28 on: 21 June 2010, 12:32:23 »

Resources? The Kaaer have access to wood and bone, surely. I would assume they have access to metal and steel but they don't do their own mining. The Osther-Oc mine from the Caaehl and can produce metal weapons so the Kaaer could trade for those. However, the clan most in contact with the Osther would be the Mist Hunters. Of any clan, the Mist Hunters would the most technologically advanced in weapons given their occupation to the dangers of the Mists.

As for a name...I am horrible with names so don't hold your breath... :P I don't even have a basic Kaaer vocabulary. The names I do have in my entries are from the talents of Alysse and Bard. One of these days I'll actually have some semblance of language for my tribe... rolleyes
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No, I would not want to live in a world without dragons, as I would not want to live in a world without magic, for that is a world without mystery, and that is a world without faith. And that, I fear, for any reasoning, conscious being, would be the cruelest trick of all.
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« Reply #29 on: 23 June 2010, 08:08:43 »

The Kaaer'dar'shin dagger is the traditional weapon of the Kaaer half-orcs of Northern Sarvonia. It is an unusual weapon. The blade of the dagger is made of the bone of the great Tsor-Shotak lizard, while the handle is wrapped in leather made from its skin. The dagger is almost always acompanied by a t'lark (a buckler made of t'sor-shotak hide) and is a religious talisman for the member of the Kaaer.

First, we need a formal name here. Did you like the one I proposed in the vocab thread? What makes this dagger unusual? Unless no other tribe creates weapons from bone, then I'd say that unusual is the case. Maybe word the t'lark bit to say that traditional Kaaer warriors use the dagger and t'lark war buckler together and have developed a swift, deadly fighting style. Instead of religious talisman, I would say that the dagger is considered central to the Kaaer belief of the hunt and is revered as a symbol of their faith.

Description
The Kaaer'dar'shin dagger is a bone knife, made from a single piece of Tsor-Shotak bone, cut and ground into a fine blade. Tsor-Shotak bones are incredibly tough, and so the blade is not as weak as one might guess from it's substance. The blade is made from the shoulder of a Tsor-Shotak, ground down to a fine edge and point.  Unlike most weapons the Kaaer'dar'shin dagger begins without an edge, in a sort of extended blunt tang. This tang curves slightly, before fanning out into a longer, leaf shaped blade.. The handle has a slight curve and is usually made out of one of the leg bones of the Tsor-Shotak, while the pommel may be one of its teeth or claws.

To the Kaaer'dar'shin and Mist Hunters, the dagger may represent a unique sort of To'vtar, which should be carried in battle. The handle of the dagger is usually adorned with some sort of charm. The claw of an uncil cat, the fang of a Tsor'Shotak, the tailfeather of an eagle or the tail of a wolf can be found adorning the pommel or the grip of a Kaaer'dar'shin warrior's dagger. In addition, the blades and handles are quite often painted with patterns in red, yellow or blue, broad curves around small dots creating stylized teeth or eyes on the sides of the blade.

A few things need explained to a first time reader:

1. The Tsor-Shotak needs to be explained as being a large lizard that the tribe hunts as a source of food, armor, weapons and even poisons. Maybe mention the lizard's territory too. I think a reader needs some background on the animal as it is important to the tribe and the construction of the dagger.

2. What is a tang?

3. Mention in a sentence or two what a to'avatar is. It is a physical representation of a spirit. In the dagger's case, it represents Durgho, the primal and chief nature spirit.

4. Specifically, the eagle is a Toran eagle. Wolves native to the area would be the snow wolf or the Ash wolf (moreso the snow wolf).


Usage
The Kaaer'dar'shin half-orcs of Northern Sarvonia and the Mist Hunters by association with that tribe, are the only ones to use the Kaaer dagger. Lack of access to Tsor-Shotak bones and the knowledge to make the knife also restricts their usage to these groups. On occasion an orc might be found with one of these daggers, however they usually break in orcish hands, since they are not accustomed to the relative fragility of the blades.

The Kaaer and Mist Hunters are the same tribe. The Mist Hunters are now denoted as a clan within the tribe. I would mention that he dagger is used by all three clans in fighting and hunting. The Mist Hunters specifically employ the daggers but likely it would not be made of Tsor-Shotak bone as the lizard is not found that far north near the Mists. In fact, I would think that the Mist Hunter dagger is made of bone from a different creature such as the oogorim or spine wyrm.

Fighting Style
The Kaaer'dar'shin dagger is not a weapon that stands up well to armor or to blocking. It is intended to be used with as little fuss from the party on the receiving end of the blow as possible. The Kaaer are quite adept at stealth, and the curve of the blade, as well as it's leaf shape makes it excellent for slicing throats as much as it is a tool for cutting things.

A harsh stabbing motion can chip or break the blade, so ideally, the motion made with it is a long cut, either with the blade held point down in the hand, or a short cut with the blade held point up. How effective this motion will be is determined by where one strikes the target. Favoured points to aim for are behind the knee, the elbow and underside of the shoulder, the neck and the inside of the thigh.

Additionally the blade can be coated with Tsor'shotak saliva to add to the lethality. Tsor'shotak saliva is incredibly toxic, and the infection resulting from a wound contaminated with this substance is a painful, slow way to die.

I would assume that Kaaer warriors desire a swift kill so they aim for the weakest points of an opponent. A throat slice is enough to kill so what use is the slow toxic saliva? I think the saliva would have better use on arrows, maybe?

It would be lax to mention the Kaaer'dar'shin dagger without mentioning the t'lark which so often accompanies it. The t'lark is a buckler made of the hide of the tsor-shotak lizard. Fighting including the t'lark keeps the buckler close at hand and exclusively uses this to block, to prevent the dagger from being damaged or broken. The t'lark is often used to make an opening by feinting an attack with the buckler, by shoving or even striking an opponent with the shield. The t'lark also serves to keep the dagger hidden from view by the opponent which allows a Kaaer warrior to lash out with the edge of the dagger in a surprise attack.

While the Kaaer try to avoid stabbing attacks with the dagger, if necessary the t'lark may be used to add extra weight to the dagger thrush by placing the hand holding the dagger in front of the buckler before striking.

Origin/History
The origins of the Kaaer'dar'shin dagger are lost to time. The Kaaer believe the method of creating the knives from the Tsor'Shotak to be a gift from the spirits, a way to bring them closer to Durgho and the Beasts in nature since they have neither claws or fangs.

I think a mention of why the Kaaer crafted daggers from bone in the first place is important. Since the Themed'lon region has no ready source of ore to mine for steel, bone crafting was developed early on as a substitute. I think a mention that the daggers can also be made of stone is important too but primarily bone is the material of choice.

The first Kaaer'dar'shin warrior is said to have been given the design for this weapon by Durgho, the Beastlord. One of the duties of a new warrior is to teach a younger warrior how to craft a dagger from the hide of the tsor-shotak, and it is with this dagger that the tsor-shotak hides for a t'lark must be taken. The Kaaer'dar'shin dagger is central to the hunt, and is sacred. The first adornments to a new dagger are often made with the blood of the first creature that it slays.

This is good. Temuuj Tartaan was the first Kaaer to introduce steathy tactics and fighting when he led the tribe to independence from the orcs. I think it would be fitting to mention him as the legendary figure who was given the dagger's design from Durgho. He is mentioned in the Kaaer entry (though I have since changed his name).

One of the ways young children are taught how to hunt is to give them a blunt or broken dagger with nutshells attached on bits of cord on the handle. These jangle together, making noise. The children must then track and "kill" their teacher or another student, who must evade the hunters for as long as they can.

Overall, this is great! The tribe is undergoing a revision at the moment, so likely some of this may change. But it is good to see this important weapon being entried!  thumbup
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No, I would not want to live in a world without dragons, as I would not want to live in a world without magic, for that is a world without mystery, and that is a world without faith. And that, I fear, for any reasoning, conscious being, would be the cruelest trick of all.
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