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Author Topic: Current King- Father+wives- Brainstorming  (Read 5382 times)
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Ta`lia of the Seven Jewels
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« on: 21 July 2005, 05:17:00 »

CuKing-Father

Where I see the current King more as a king Salomo, who builds on the efforts of king David, his father should be a powerful king like David - or Santhros, aware of his power, outgoing, a man very present and openly demanding.

If the CuKing has to ascend the throne with the age of 25, his father has to die around this time. He could have died young, but we thought about another story:

He has a true love in his youth (Stratanian?), but his Queen is either barren, or miscarries, or the babies die after birth. She sees, that she can‘t give the kingdom the promised heir and commits suicide to make the way free for another marriage (The king would not have followed the advice of his councillors to marry another woman).

After the death of his beloved wife, he has to marry again . He learns to love the new queen (tribe?) as well (not so tender, however). This queen gives the country three children:
1. A daughter, very promising, but when she comes into puberty, it shows, that she is a very powerful seer and has to become a priest of Seyella
2. Another daughter who dies young (with 5 ? illness, riding accident, could be a tragic persons entry)
3. A son - he will become the future king.

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Fluffy Ramblers
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« Reply #1 on: 21 July 2005, 18:05:00 »

I don't like this suicide. It's just... you don't commit a suicide because you want the man you love to have a son, no matter if he's a king or not. The way you describe it, it sounds too grotesque and meaningless. One has to be completely broken and obedient to end one's life like this.


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Rayne (Alýr)
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« Reply #2 on: 21 July 2005, 18:21:00 »

I have to agree with Fluffy on this one. The idea of a Queen committing suicide for the King to have an heir seems a little much. I mean, it seems like if the marriage was done in love, it wouldn't matter if there was an heir or not. The brother or cousin of the king would produce an heir who could take the throne, and no one would have to die. Why can't the Stratanian Queen just be his first and only wife?

And if we have the CuKing's daughter die at age 5... that just seems like a lot of death. The King's reign might be viewed more as a curse than a blessing.

Edit: Can I do the person's entry on the CuKing's Seer-daughter? Has her biography been detailed very much?

Edited by: Rayne Avalotus at: 7/21/05 2:23
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Ta`lia of the Seven Jewels
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« Reply #3 on: 22 July 2005, 01:52:00 »

Well, we wanted that the current king ascends the throne with a young age, with 25 - so , taking that the old king has to die before the young can ascend the throne - we wanted him to be quite old. But then the questionarises - why did he have no children earlier?The solution was a barren wife. Of course she can die in childbirth, and the child with her, but is that any better? The second wife is then younger and can be "kingmother" for quite some time.

The suicide - it is fitting for a great love, I think. You will do it, if you see your love suffer. Maybe she is already wornout through miscarriage. I assumed now, that there is no uncle, nephew to step in, or this is no option, and the king is urged by the council to abandon his (living) wife to take a new one, who can provide a heir.

The death of his older (little ) sister can of course be omitted, but I don't think, there is too much death around - the middle ages were not gently to the people, and death was something you had to live with. Every normal family lost one or more children to disease or other things. (Think alone of Martin Luther, who had to bury two of his six children, and there are worse examples)I don't think, that people will think, the CuKing is cursed.

I even thought of letting die one of the Kings own children - that would have influence on his char , but let's see, with waht we come up.

LOL, I was always told, that Santharia is not a "heile Welt"-an ideal world!

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Edited by: Talia Sturmwind  at: 7/21/05 9:55
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Ta`lia of the Seven Jewels
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« Reply #4 on: 22 July 2005, 02:04:00 »

Rayne, I don't have objections against you writing the seer sister, but it will take some time, till the king is on the way and before that, a start is not advisible, for there can always be the need to change something.

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Rayne (Alýr)
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« Reply #5 on: 22 July 2005, 07:05:00 »

Ok. Here's a proposal:

The king and queen are married, and try continuously to produce an heir, without producing one. The Queen continuously has miscarriages, or is simply barren. This old Queen and King don't separate, but let's say the old king is taken by disease and dies.

However, the King has a brother, who then, with reluctance because he is forced to give up his place in the military, takes up the throne. He is somewhat old and unmarried, and quickly assumes a younger wife (the Stratanian woman, if you please) who not only helps to soften his rough nature (one he aquired from his time in the military) but also gives him an heir. This would be our CuKing. The CuKing's father dies of old age, and we have an early ascension.

In this manner, we have no unnatural deaths, and we still get a young king of a "pure" lineage.

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Ta`lia of the Seven Jewels
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« Reply #6 on: 22 July 2005, 07:34:00 »

Well, let's see, what others think, for I think, "unnatural" deaths are quite common. And more tragic, up and down , more drama and life is in our version.
But I understand your feelings -  when I was as old as you, I would have never let a slightly sypathic person die - my at night thought-out- stories  had always a happy end.

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"For me there is only the traveling on paths that have heart, on any path   that may have heart. There I travel, and the only worthwhile challenge is to traverse its full length. And there I travel looking, looking, breathlessly. ~Don Juan"

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« Reply #7 on: 22 July 2005, 07:38:00 »

I don't know. The suicide does strike me as a bit much - a suicide is inspired by love, but that does not mean someone would kill themselves to "free up the spot". It might be more likely that she is somehow caught up in a court intrigue, perhaps even murdered (or her husband deposed). But the suicide somehow doesn't fit. The motivation is too... banal?


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Edited by: Arancaytar Ilyaran at: 7/21/05 15:40
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Thuja
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« Reply #8 on: 22 July 2005, 12:40:00 »

So how about a court intrigue.  Instead of suicide she is murdered by others.  They felt that the king should have put her aside in favor of another woman who could give heirs to the kingdom.  When the king would not do this out of love, a convienent "accident"  was arranged for her.  This way the royalist would have their way and a new queen would be selected so that the royal line would continue.  

Just an idea to throw out there.  Need others to give their two sans.


In this life the old believe everything, the middle-aged suspect everything, and the young know everything. —Anonymous

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Erian Melor
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« Reply #9 on: 22 July 2005, 12:53:00 »

You could make it where the king executed the wife when she could not produce a heir. But then that would eliminate your true love thing, unless he loved the idea of fatherhood more than he loved her. Also, he could execute her in a fit of rage and regret it later. Just an idea.:biggrin  

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Fluffy Ramblers
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« Reply #10 on: 22 July 2005, 21:13:00 »

Well, if you have to kill the king's wife, then the intrigue version would be better. If our...

I hereby name thee Cathlar. Stand up, young king.
Any objections?
Please?


So, if our Cathlar is still young when he ascends the throne, someone will try to manipulate him, using his certain lack of experience. Some duke, for example, who wants to have more influence in the kingdom, could have the idea to marry the king with his daughter or sister, especially if the queen is barren. Of course, in order to do this the duke has to get rid of the queen. So, he hires an assasin to murder her and leave traces which have to lead to a rival family. (I'm still in the Italian renaissance *smiles*)

This would also be a starting point for developing the relationships between the noble houses, as well as the inner politics in the kingdom.


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Edited by: Fluffy Ramblers at: 7/22/05 5:15
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Lucius Helvil
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« Reply #11 on: 22 July 2005, 22:09:00 »

Quote:
The king and queen are married, and try continuously to produce an heir, without producing one. The Queen continuously has miscarriages, or is simply barren. This old Queen and King don't separate, but let's say the old king is taken by disease and dies.
-Rayne Avalotus

I like this version. The whole sucide thing is a bit extream for me. Just speed it up a bit so it is a little more like this.

The king and queen have some issues producing an heir. Before long the not very well liked king dies misteriously. It could have been a posion or something by someone in the court like mentioned before. The younger, very popular, brother takes up the throne at age 25 conciding with his marrige with his lovely, very pretty, new wife, who is about age 23.  

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Gean Firefeet
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« Reply #12 on: 23 August 2005, 13:34:00 »

I'm taking a bit of all the scenario's proposed before et voila, scenario numbre 15.2alpha:

CuKiFa and CuKiMo(1) have issues getting a child, the queen has a few miscarriages(sp?), but then finally produces healthy offspring, although dieing in the act. The whole kingdom rejoices because they have a healthy child and therefore a hear to the throne, although they mourn the queen who fought so bravely for the king. Now we have ten years of happiness, till they find out the child be claimed by this goddess because of her gifts. The king, faced with the new situation, has to choose a new wife. He can still produce offspring, man are simply still fertile at a later age, say beginning of his forties. He takes a younger wife (possibly with the whole scenario which Fluffy described, nobles competing for the position of queen for their daughters or nieces), which has less trouble producing offspring, though the first child dies after a few years, but in the meanwhile she has gained a younger brother, whom will be Carthal (I do like the name which Fluffy proposed), our CuKing.


I do dislike the suicide idea, because it sounds to made up for the occasion. I think we can have more probable causes to make the story more lively, like dieing in the act of birth, fights for birthrights with lethal consequences or court intrigue, but a suicide because you have no male offspring is too much for me.

Shall we continue till we've found a story which is liked by all, so, do we have more questions, comments, suggestions etc.

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Gwai'ayia Quillouf
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« Reply #13 on: 27 February 2009, 00:40:14 »

I know this topic is a bit old but since its a worthy idea, I'm not about to let it die!

As a history buff myself, may I make a suggestion to this thread:  To find that which you do not know, use what you do.  As my history professors love tell me a person, especially a ruler, is the product of his geography, the previous ruler (sometimes his parent, sometimes not), the history of his country, the beliefs (religious and suspicines), his parents (reflecting both their good qualities, their bad ones, at the same time their opposite while being their copy), his personal history, and the immediate history surrounding him i.e. the last 150 years or so which give or take a few years should equal the last three ruling kings and their impacts.

Santharia is wonderful in the fact that we have all facts available to us, well almost all.  We know the last 150 years or so of history, the beliefs of Santharia, and the history of Santharia and Calereth in general.

Of what do not know we can infer from what we do know.  Take this as an example from the entry of Princess Shiana.

Quote
older sister of our current king, the Santhran Tiandor of House Salazath. Princess Shiana's abdication of the throne which she was destined to take over as the first child of Santhran Grothian and his second wife Queen Lady Jaleth,

From this short quote we can gather the following facts, our current kings title or name (not sure if Santhran Tiandor of House Salazath is title or name), that he is younger by at least  10 months than Princess Lady Shiana (the shortest period of time between children possible in humans), and that he is the child of Santhran Grothian and an unknown wife.  We can guess or infer that he was the child of Santrhran Grothian’s second wife Queen Lady Jaleth, but it is possible that he had a third wife.  Also from the same entry we can guess some of the influences present in our current’s King's life not the least of which could possibly be his older sister.

So you see what I mean?  Using this process of interference or guessing from known fact we can construct the biography of our current in no time at all hopefully.
« Last Edit: 27 February 2009, 00:42:55 by Gwai'ayia Quillouf » Logged

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Gwai'ayia
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« Reply #14 on: 27 February 2009, 01:59:38 »

Unfortunately it is not as easy as this.

 We know much more already, but some of the data were lost during the transfer of the boards, at least for the board (they might be in an old backup on my external harddrive), some are buried elsewhere. (I think I have started a persons entry on Tiandor already)
 I had planned to open a thread/board for New Santhala, maybe we should do this for the current King as well.

I thought even to write  down the history of the last 50 years SOON ;) Not next week though ;) It is already done more ot less.

I might dig out some more information for you in the near future, Judith marriage table should linger around as well, so, keep searching ;)
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