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Author Topic: Categorization Proposal  (Read 5253 times)
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Ken Shinjin
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« on: 09 January 2006, 00:11:00 »

Short Blades
    - Knives
    - Daggers
    - Silverphial
    - R’unorian Dagger

Broadswords
    - Shortsword
    - Longsword
    - Erpheronian Broadsword
    - Nightclaw

Backswords
    - Scimitar
    - Katana / Moonblade

Two-Handed Swords
    - Claymore
    - Greatsword
    - Flamberge
    - Whirlwind

Axes
    - Hand axe
    - Great axe
    - Battle-axe
    - etc etc etc

Blunt Weapons
    - Club
    - Mace
    - Flail
    - Warhammer
    - Maul
    - Efryst
    - Striker

Polearms
    - Spear
    - Lance
    - Pike
    - Javelin (polearm/missile)
    - Halberd
    - Jarga
    - Bardiche
    - Scythe

Missile Weapons
    - Shortbow
    - Longbow
    - Crossbow
    - Arbalest
    - Recurve bow
    - Sling-shot
    - Blowpipe
    - Orcish Warbow
    - Sling

Throwing Weapons
    - Throwing knife
    - Throwing star
    - Throwing axe
    - Boomerang
    - Moondeath
    - Salen Pins
    - Seatooth

Miscellaneous Weapons
    - Steel fan
    - Claw
    - Sickle
    - Arm Blade
    - Corran’Loh
    - Razorclaw
    - Scourge

Weapons That Aren’t Weapons
    - Eya-Hoe
    - Tooth-Hoe

Weapons That Need Clarification
    - Judgement Quill
    - Steelurchin
    - Touch of Death
    - T’weep

Okay, the explanations.  First I shall point out that you will note new weapons that did not exist before.  These are mostly farm tools that I believe would naturally be developed over time.  These I will most likely develop last, as I would like to revise and edit the current weapons before making all-new ones.

Weapons entitled "Weapons That Aren't Weapons" are both types of hoes that should, I believe, be listed in the Gear and Tools section.

Weapons entitled "Weapons That Need Clarification", you will notice are all assassin weapons.  While going through all the listed equipment for information on how to classify the weapons, I noticed there were a great number of different kinds of daggers and things of the sort.  And some of them just didn't seem to make sense.  Such as the Judgement Quill.  I'd have to see a picture of the weapon before I could believe that it could actually do the jobs listed, and I know almost for a fact that the Quill is too large to slide underneath platemail.  Pretty much, I just need a different wording on them to make sure I understand what was trying to be said. (P.S. I believe that all of these weapons belong in the Short Blades category, with the exception of the Quill, which should be in Misc. Weapons.)

Oh yes, in the Polearm section, I will most likely just have spear, javelin, and pike all in the one entry, but for ease, I've left them as separate entries for now.

Also, I noticed that the "broadsword" is a specific weapon in Caelereth.  I think the Erpheronian Broadsword should take its place as the "wide" blade, because the term "broadsword" is actually just a generic term for a European, double-sided sword.  So that's why Broadsword is now just a general category.

And for similar purposes, I've placed all the single-sided swords such as the scimitars and the moonblade into the category "backswords" because "backsword" is a general term for any sword that has a single-side blade.  i.e. a falchion, or a katana.

This is just a suggestion, but I think if the Weapons Overview is changed into these 10 categories, it will make navigating the site much easier.  And any and all of these could change, so if this setup is accepted, feel free to leave out the weapons that dont' have entries yet (like claymore and whatnot, as those may change or just not be added).

I'll have more information and details for you all soon, but comments and questions are always welcome!  (Oh yes, and sorry for the length of this post...)

Edited by: Artimidor Federkiel at: 7/9/06 10:10
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Artimidor Federkiel
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« Reply #1 on: 09 January 2006, 02:37:00 »

Look cool to me as well:)  - A general note for now:

If we split up our weapons in these categories, we will split it most likely (eventually, we'll start bit by bit I assume) in the Misc. menu, so that you'll see these sub-categories listed once you click on "Weapons & Armour" and then can click on such a sub-category to see everything it contains in the menu (Armour for now will stay in an own sub-category, I'd say).

Ideally this means that we'll also start establishing Overviews for the categories. For now we just have one single Weapons page, which links to everything weapon-like, be it an entry on the category itself (Axes, Swords) or on something specific inside a category (Erpheronian Broadsword).

Plan: We should change this main weapons page to a page (sooner or later) that first talks in general about the importance, origins of weapons and then lists the categories one by one with short descriptions (and pics) and links to these sub-overviews, just like the menu is structured - know what I mean?

All these things cannot be done at once of course, the categorization will take a while. So just go in the direction you think you can work best - but I just wanted to sketch the general outline from my point of view how we perhaps could structure these overview pages, so that menu and pages fit together:)  - What do you think?


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Ken Shinjin
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« Reply #2 on: 09 January 2006, 12:20:00 »

Well, you managed to pretty much nail what I was planning on doing.  For now, yes, the armor should go in its own sub-category with the weapons, and we can later go into much more detail if you'd like.  But right now weapons are: a) more diverse and plentiful in types, b) thus more fun.

And yes, I never had any intention of moving weapons to its own menu or out of the Miscellaneous menu.  But hopefully when the project is all finished, it will be much easier to navigate it.

Now, time to begin work on the outline that you suggested.

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Artimidor Federkiel
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« Reply #3 on: 22 January 2006, 13:47:00 »

Oh, BTW - not precisely a "melee weapon", but nevertheless something that fits into this section are the "Siege Engines", which you haven't mentioned here. Guess they'd deserve an own section with that name. We already have two pretty good and well illustrated entries in this context methinks (the Battering Ram and the Orcristh Ballista). And we have a cool picture of Quellion showing an Onager as well, so there's also a possibility for an entry there:)   - Don't know if you have any deeper knowledge of siege engines as well, Ken, but just wanted to mention them in order not to forget about them here in our weapons categorization!


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Edited by: Artimidor Federkiel at: 1/21/06 20:50
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Ruil Mallister
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« Reply #4 on: 22 January 2006, 18:17:00 »

Alright, I've officially grown tired of waiting.  My profile has been forced into holding, and due to my perfectionism, the lack of an avatar and signature on Ken was officially grating on my nerves.  So now my foolish want to make my first post on Santh my profile has waned and given way to the solution of just posting as my main account: Ruil.

And you're absolutely correct, Arti.  I completely forgot about siege weapons.  I know of some various siege equipments and their use, but as for the intricacies, I haven't yet done heavy research on them.  I would be most willing to spend some time on those as well.

Right now I'm getting some basic drafts and outlines done for the different weapons, such as ideas for different kinds of weapons for the various races and tribes.




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and the perseverence of duty and vigilance... I live."

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Artemis
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« Reply #5 on: 23 January 2006, 14:05:00 »

When writing about daggers, could you please take what I have written about them within the Zarathian tribe entry into consideration?

Entry here - www.santharia.com/tribes/...thians.htm

As you can see, the dagger has become important to them and their way of life, and also their bladesmiths are revered throughout Caelereth, a Zarathian dagger being of great value, so it would be nice if you could imcorporate that into your entry.

Thankyou!

:D  :D  :D  

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Ruil Mallister
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« Reply #6 on: 23 January 2006, 16:50:00 »

Sure thing, Artemis.  Thank you for pointing that out in advance!  That will help give me much better focus when writing the post.  I'll keep it in mind...

Zarathians.  Daggers.  Love.  Got it.




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and the perseverence of duty and vigilance... I live."

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xerampelinae deicida
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« Reply #7 on: 28 January 2006, 01:56:00 »

Should armor be included in the weapons section?

What about seige weapons battering rams catapults etc. ?

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Stormraven
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« Reply #8 on: 09 February 2006, 02:14:00 »

Broadswords
- Shortsword
- Longsword
- Erpheronian Broadsword
- Nightclaw

Hmmm....Not to quible but broadswords, longswrods, and shortswords need to be divided up a bit. A broadswoard is not just a generalization for all double edged swords but a specific style of sword that has a broader and longer blade and hilt blade than other swords, also refered to as a bastard or hand and a half sword.  Also, because of diffences in length of various swords the fighting styles are remarkably different. The nightsword could fall under the shortsword category however. maybe create a category for longswords one for shortsword, one for broadsword, and one for greatswords, i.e. Claymores and such.

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Ruil Mallister
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« Reply #9 on: 10 February 2006, 18:53:00 »

Hm, sorry Stormraven.  You're a little off.

A "broadsword" is, as I've described, like a "backsword" or like how the Japanese use the term "katana."  They are all general terms.

Bastardswords were named thus because they were observed to have qualities as if they were the offspring of a two-handed sword and a longsword (5ft + and 3ft swords).  That's how the bastardsword was named, its other, probably more official, name is the hand-and-half sword.

And these are categories based on the weapons themselves and the qualities they have.  Like "polearms".  A spear and a glaive are used in very different ways, but both are polearms.  I broke down swords merely because there are far too many types of swords to try to work with and put in the same category.

As for "broadsword"... I explained that I will simply replace all of the previous "broadswords" that were wider than the normal with Erpheronian Broadsword.  It is simply better, more accurate, and should keep things much more simple this way.




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Lucius Helvil
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« Reply #10 on: 01 March 2006, 16:59:00 »

Back on the topic of seige weapons. There are just a few basic weapons. There was the battering ram, of which an entry has already been completed. There also were seige towers, catapults, scorpins(large crossbows), and trebuchets. Those are the only historical siege weapons to my knowlage. I thought if any more could be invented, but I don't think there is any more. Anyway that is my little peice of info about seige weapons.

Edited by: Lucius Helvil at: 3/1/06 0:01
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Curgan
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« Reply #11 on: 03 March 2006, 18:17:00 »

I think the Centoraurian shortsword is forgotten....

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« Reply #12 on: 14 March 2006, 21:55:00 »

Ok I will concede the idea about broadswords but I don't agree. I have a problem with the backswords as well Backswords are defined as follows

The backsword was a weapon popularized during the 17th and 18th centuries in Europe as a secondary weapon for mounted cavalry soldiers. The name backsword derived from the way the cavalryman would sling the weapon in a sheath behind his back while riding in order to prevent it from clanging against his or the horse’s side as they galloped along. The backsword was essentially very saber-like. The backsword blade had two basic variations: generally straight for thrusting, or slightly curved for both thrusting and slashing. The backsword was a very versatile weapon, dangerous both from a mounted position as well as dismounted. Note the two blade variations depicted in the images.

So listing the scimitar and the moonblade/katana as backswords won't work.  

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« Reply #13 on: 05 July 2006, 11:52:00 »

Don't forget the Kilij, I will finish it in the not so far future.

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Drasil Razorfang
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« Reply #14 on: 09 July 2006, 08:31:00 »

*points to his entry*

As I said, Ruil's doesn't have the more recent weapons as well as all of the mentioned weapons.  That is the only flaw I can find with his categorization, but I am not as experienced as most others.

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